What do you use to determine a good spot to fish in URW? What is it that makes some spots better than others? Do some spots get fished out? Are there better times of day to fish? What other advice might you all have?

WARNING! Personal experience following!

Okay my advice would be fish at rapids; fish at sunrise/set;
use nets

Personally I never hat a spot 'fish out', and I never noticed a difference from one spot to - for example - 3 meters away.

Obviously, nets are best because they are passive. You place them and come back 12-48 hours later and get a catch.

Nets on rapids do well. With Nets timing is pretty irrelevant.
Small Hours seems to be the absolute best fishing for me for poles/tridents.

Nets on Rapids is the way to go. Active fishing is too much fiddly.

You spend all your loots on Nets from several villages. When it's over 6 you got a viable way of living. When it's over 10 you got a foodmaking machine there.

Perch: a kind of currency, lighter than meat cuts, and easier to make in large number.

Salmon/Trout: Big fishes. String 19 big ones on a cord and smoke them.

a good rule of thumb I used is to check my nets any time my character wakes up. Passive fishing is the way to go active fishing is a bit monotonous and even with 75% fishing skill its still hard to get enough food. Active fishing is a good way to slowly starve to death though 1 trout or pike is 3/4 of a hunger bar.

One thing to remember is that fishes are food for survival, not for trade. If you want goods to trade for villagers, you should hunt for big game or fight Njer, not fish.

Odd. I've never had a problem with fishing to live, even with low skill.

I mean fish, after cooked, has a low value in trade. It's my impression from previous version, anyway.

A fish may weight 3-5lbs, effectively equal to 3-5 meat cuts. But the value to trade is not that equal.

With Nets, you have a good way to fish: Big fish to eat, small to roast/smoke/dry for trade later. With 15-20 Nets on a rapid map, after 2 weeks you will have enough to worth go shopping. After one winter concentrate solely on Nets and Fishing Rods, you will have enough dried foods for 6 months, plus more than enough small fishes as trade goods to buy anything you want.

The diet is monotonous, but survivable.

I also have never had a problem fishing for a living, any of my characters with a 40 or above fishing skill can go fine with a trident or a fishing rod.

I really like the variety fishing adds, and if you've got a decent skill it seems slightly more reliable than running all over the countryside chucking javelins at squirrels, but yeah, it's not really something you need to mess with once you bring down your first big animal.

I never use nets myself though, they make things a little too easy. I'm guessing it's not possible to mod in a passive way to fish that catches things in smaller quantities yet, but I've always thought that would be nice.

and lets be honest, fishing is a little boring in this game, and the most Ive ever gotten from one net/fishing season is 1-3 days worth of food. I have downed elk with more than 600 cuts of food and that's good for 2-3 seasons

A huge fishing overhaul is something I want to do at some point. Adding more passive and active fishing techniques and tackle, spawning times for different fish and so on.

So I'm most interested to hear if anyone has got some ideas about how to make fisherman's life more interesting and vivid.

Homemade fishtraps, EG. with 20 sticks, some tying equipment, and a rock you could create a trap that would be the same as a net just less reliable and smaller catches.

Maybe bears could spawn more commonly near rapids during the salmon run.

Maybe if you could lead your own town or have a family fishing would be more valuable, because you would need more food.

Collecting bait?


Rare species which you could "collect" (maybe it would show up somewhere of you character sheet, like it could say "rare species log" and it would list all the rare kills and catches you have gotten. Albinos for mammals and birds?)

• Using small fish as bait
• smaller rivers/streams that are 1-20 tiles across and easier to cross and/or net
• actually put rocks/boulders/land tiles jutting out of rapids
• making swimming more dangerous, especially in rapids
• shallow water you can walk in (favored by bank/shallow water fish)
• fish traps

All in all I'd think you'd want to modify fishing along with an overall overhaul of how water works so you can have rain filled pits/ponds, waterfalls/cataracts, brooks/streams, beavers making lodges/dams/lakes etc so that the water is a more dynamic environment.

bigger fishes and more types if that fits in the setting, don't know much about finnish fish!

maybe better fishing rods, like considering the actual one primitive and making it craftable, plus an advanced version only sold in fishing stores like punts, that is more effective.

more factors to affect chance to get a particular catch like time of day and season

having to "scan" the area for a half hour or so to determine the kinds of fish that could be caught there and what the chance is to get a catch if your skill is good enough, as a fishing menu subcommand

different baits for different fish

fixed structures like fish traps near the shore (traps sub-menu?)

That's a good question. Because it's not exactly thrill a minute in real life!

What's coming to me is perhaps have something we'll call 'fishing superstitions'. Like you fish, but every so often it pauses and a text comes up describing something, like dappled lights on the water. Then it'll come up with a random fishing supertition, described in text (spitting in the water...), that's supposed to bring more luck at that time and you say whether you do it or not. Some do give more luck, some nothing, others spoil your luck (like moving around too much actually scares the fish). Sometimes it'd give a message when a superstition is lucky in combination with the situation. So over time the player can remember these. In this way the player can actually get more skilled at fishing, and also remember finnish fishing superstitions.

Actually I might use that idea in my PBBG I'm making, as wel....

I suggested something like this awhile back, and it's something I've been wanting for a long time now. If there's a way to mod in a tool that acts like a net, but with a catch size about on par with a fishing rod, I haven't figured it out yet.

Different baits == different fish. But that would need fishing baits to be added in to the game.

Time of day affecting chance to catch something. Fishing with rood is generally most successful in the morning and in the evening ...except winter time.

Fishing with spear/trident/club should be less successful in deeper water and should be influenced by light -you can not fish this way in the dark. Unsuitable for catching smaller fish.

Light attract fish during night -fire on the bank should rise chance to catch something in surrounding tiles regardless of technique.

Small lakes should have lower chance of catching something, especially larger fish.

Current "fishing net" is bit unspecified item in the game as is technique using it. Most fishing techniques with net are much more active than game suggest currently. I think most appropriate technique for using net in setting of this game is this:



Fishing is done in relatively active way: you put net (attached on to long stake) in to the water, wait some time, usually in scale of minutes or hours, then pull it up rapidly. Fish is not entangled in to the net while it is in the water. Rather it is pulled from water as you pull the net so time you keep net in the water is used to let fish get over net (it most probably fled the spot as you planted net in to the water). It is much more similar to fishing with rood. It makes no sense to keep net in the water too long. Doesn't increase chance to catch something.

You can usually use more than one fishing rood during fishing and increase chance of catching something. Especially if you fish in the lake. You can't use it in rapids. In fact it is possible to plant fishing rood at the bank and let fish catch itself without your presence. Then come back an check the rood.

I prolly missed the ones i'm about to put down

types of current fishing equipment: (in order of how well they work)

Net
F. Rod
Trident(L&S)
Spear
Javelin
Club

now in my oppinion all these should first off be craftable, but not as good as the ones you buy at the shop. Also. with the Max fishing skill you should only catch fish 50% of the time. Now I will explain how the tools should work:

Net (passive) just like it works now except the nets takes wear dmg% and the dmg% potential increases by 10% every day the player doesn't pull it in and re set it. player can repair net with cord. (active) shop net: 50% bonus to fishing skill. Crafted net 25% to fishing skill, able to catch multiple fish, both large and small fish, fishing session 1 to 2 hours

F. Rod Shop bought F. Rod. 35% bonus to fishing skill. Crafted F. Rod 15% bonus to fishing skill. not able to catch multiple fish, but can catch both large and small fish. but fishing session time is up to 1 hour max

Trident (Large trident) shop bought 20% bonus to fishing skill, player crafted 5% bonus to fishing skill/ only able to catch large fish. 10% chance to catch 3 fish at once whenever you catch fish. basically same thing for small trident except it can catch only small fish. fishing time session for both 1 to 3 hours

Spear shop bought: 10% bonus to fishing skill, crafted: no bonus. able to catch large and small fish, no multiple fish caught, fishing session time 1 to 4 hours

Javelin shop bought, no bonus, crafted -10% to fishing skill. able to catch small and large fish, no multiple fish caught. 10% chance you loose javelin in water after every successful catch. fishing session time 2 to 4 hours

Club shop bought -15% to fishing skill, crafted -30% to fishing skill. only large fish caught, no multiple fish caught. 25% chance for player to fall down(climbing dmg) after every successful catch



hope you like the ideas.




and yea I'm longwinded :D

It'd be neat to see fishing weirs introduced to the game. Sort of a trap line for fishing; one more construction you could work on. Have it in a manner so that every couple of hours, a check is made, and fish are added to the trap portion if the check passes. Then, when the player wants to collect his fish, he comes back with a trident or spear. Active fishing in the weir takes just a few minutes instead of hours and has a high probability of catching fish inside, which removes them from the trap and internal counter. The end result would be something like a cross between nets, fishing poles, and trap lines.

In order to keep it interesting, have it get damaged over time, possibly when there are large fish present, large numbers of fish, when the river freezes, or after rain/flooding. Damaged weirs introduce an escape rate check with more damage meaning a higher escape rate (to the point that fish exit as quickly as they come in. Things like the trapping skill might result in higher quality weir sections that degrade slower. And if the player had to take it down before winter, set it up again in the spring, and take care of it during the year, it'd add a bit of work necessary for the free food.

Even more interesting would be if animals would raid the weirs; bears could cause major damage, otters and waterbirds might steal fish, etc.

Overall, it'd give players something interesting to build and maintain, could serve as a way to store fish live before cooking them (provided you keep up on maintenance), give an excuse to use tridents and the like to harvest from the trap, and serve as a means for attracting wildlife that would provide some conflict and animals to hunt. You might end up hunting a family of otters, not for the fur or meat, but because they keep stealing food (especially if they're hard to catch, able to dive, escape down riverbank holes if animal burrows are ever added, etc).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fishing_weir

While all of these suggestions are great, I don't think you'll ever make fishing all that interesting really until you implement the water being able to move your watercraft about while either traveling, waiting, resting, sleeping, and fishing (either active or passive).

Simple reason I believe this is that I've had experience out on the water both while motor boating and sailing, and my experience is that you rarely, if ever, can stand your boat perfectly still while out on the water.

The current (and if your in a sailboat which isn't in the game the wind) will move your boat around at least a little bit.

So I think, if you want to make fishing, and rafting interesting in general, you will want to implement some sort of currents system that moves your raft or punt around while your in the water.



Basically you'll also want to up the ante by making it so that if you move into tile with a large boulder on it while your navigating a raft or punt in the water, there should be a chance for your watercraft to break and drop it's contents (including you) into the water. Maybe leave the 3 logs that make up the raft behind (or if it's a punt, maybe some driftwood?) and implement being able to grab onto driftwood and move about while in the water without such a high risk of drowning, so that you can at least get back to land safely.



Basically, rafts and punts are a tad bit overpowered the way they are in the game right now, because they can basically be used as a platform to raid njerpez from and sleep on while virtually nothing else can get to you, which I doubt was intended in the first place.

And yea, I know some njerpez come with bows (I mean that's how I get all my hunting bows so), but still, I don't think people safely slept on rafts on a regular basis back in Finland.

I could be wrong on this however, and I don't expect many people to take warmly to the idea either. But it would certainly make fishing far more interesting.

All good points. Adding currents would improve the feel of the game, even just for traveling. Moving against the current or through rapids could be very exhausting. And rapids could be a dangerous place instead of just being the best place to cast a net.

Giggling is done during night actually, at least in Finland. It does need a strong light source to attract and spot fish though, so one or two lit torches per attempt sounds a good requirement.

I also think giggling should be less of the desperate man's fishing it currently is. It was actually banned by law in Finland at one point (and still partly is), mostly due to being extremely effective during spawing periods. It should perhaps be bit more skill dependant than fishing with rod and involve spear skill check as well. It's also more weather dependant since it needs still water surface for best effect. We don't have wind or waves, but rain should reduces the chances at least.

It's also perfectly possible to catch perches and whatnot with tridents, though size of the tool should affect this.

Something I do is a bit more based on rituals. When I get a successful catch, I sacrifice it for a catch, do the Fisherman's Request for A Catch, then go at it with a fishing rod. This works best for me, and greatly increases you chances, I've gotten a couple of good pots from this, and started doing this for my nets too before casting them out, but it seems to be a bit less effective that way.

I'd like to see the addition of shellfish - fresh/saltwater clams, crayfish (jokirapu) and the tools to harvest them. staffs could be used as digging sticks, players could build small crab pots and use the little fish as bait.

maybe then I could string some shells for a necklace for my character.... :)

You could make active fishing more interesting by adding a bit of a mini game to it. Even something as simple as the normal wait time but at times throughout the wait when fish comes the mini game pops up. It could be as simple as a meter sliding back and forth and needing to click at a marked spot to thrust your spear or pull in the fighting fish.

I know that is a bit outside the normal style from what Ive seen so far but it might make active fishing a bit more entertaining. That aside there are a lot of other interesting ideas in the thread. I look forward to what comes next!

No quicktime events, please.

+1

Maybe a puzzle type deal or something then? The idea was more to make you actually have an impact on active fishing then it was about quick time.

But you already do have an impact on fishing. Or rather your fishing skill. Adding some sort of arcadish mini-game or puzzle would take out lots of the feel , for me at least.

What would be very welcomed however, is baits, metal/bone hooks, different kinds of rods and lines that player can/must use in order to fish. Better your tools and enjoy great catch.

First of all; welcome to the forums, Roh.
As already pointed out by few UrW-veterans a common, fancy quick time event wouldn't really fit in the game. But especially in case of fishing I think sort of "mini-game" could be appropriate - I'd just implement it as text based multi-choice dialog.

You feel a twitch. Select option:

1. pull the fishing rod quickly
2. pull the fishing rod slowly
3. let out a little more fishing line
4. just wait

Of course there wouldn't be twenty questions per fishing attempt, but just occasionally.

Text based mini game...That might be fun.
Actually "space rangers2" did mix text based games with 3D and 2D arcade with some good results. However, as a Interactive Fiction fan, my perception might be slightly biased...

isn't it bit like the melee combat is now? Something happens, and the player is given options to choose from; block, dodge, ignore, counter-strike - your turn; hit again, run for cover...

---

Today I spent couple of hours on the ice, trying to catch fish. I got none. But the options were; keep on trying in this same spot for another ten minutes - stop now and move to another place...

I think making it so that when you use a fishing rod if it zoomed in again to the few tiles around where you are fishing at and you had a choice of where to cast similar to the throwing/archery way of aiming would be pretty awesome. For example casting closer to reeds or plants could increase your chance of catching fish, but also increase the chance of getting your hook stuck. Also bait for the appropriate fish that should be out at that time and different hook sizes/types.

Then it goes back to the wait and hope that it already is. Also, I dislike how you end up fishing for 3 or 4 hours. Although I may fish for that long I'd probably move around a bit after no bites for an hour and not even seeing any small fish swimming near the bank. Text messages about what you see would be pretty cool even if you failed. In winter it could just be like "You didn't feel any bites and the ice is too thick to see through."

"you pull with all your might but only succeed in losing your hook"

"it feels like you have a fish on your hook, but when you pull it in you find only a bit of weed that was floating down the stream"

"you cast your line too close to an old snag in the water and get your hook hopelessly stuck. do you want to wade in after it or tie a new hook on the line?"


it would be nice if the fishing action would last only 20-30 min before auto-ending, if I sat that long in one spot without catching anything I think I'd get up and move. the action would only last until you catch a fish or the time runs out, then you could try again or try a different spot.

I'm also interested in seeing different species of fish in fresh versus saltwater. A little bit off topic, but is there a plan to introduce seal hunting that some of the northern cultures could pursue? Obviously this would be limited to the sea, and possibly even certain areas of sea.

I know that Finland doesn't have any polar bears, but did iron-age Finland extend to the polar ice? I always get a kick out of my relatives asking me if I'm in danger from polar bears here :lol:

IRL we have seals everywhere :D

In the old times they were hunting seal in the south-western archipelago and on the western seacoast. Also, we have a special kind of seal living in the big lakes.

So, yes, we hope that some day they are to be found in the game too.

Also, all of our seas do freeze over in the winter. So theoretically speaking it might be possible to leave the northern coast and walk all the way up to the pole. But I still don't know if that counts as polar ice...

And Aislinn, maybe you should tell your relatives that in Finland the real danger is posed by bi-polar bears :rolleyes:

Cool, I'll look forward to seals. Another fishing idea, not sure if it's been said elsewhere, would be the ability to make our own fish traps. This would require willows or some other bendable shrub that could maybe only grow along riverbeds or in specific types of land.

Also, a little unrelated but having to do with the sea--shouldn't drinking sea water make the characters sick? I remember when I first started playing the game I wondered if the yes/no menu that pops up every time you go to drink somehow implied that there was good or bad water in the game and some of it might make you sick. If that is the case, I haven't noticed it...