Getting Death Shrieked By Terrorgheist

Ok guys first I want to say I am a dual Orc / Vampire Count player and I am playing both armies almost equally currently. But I want as close to an unbiased opinion (meaning non-vampire general) as I can get of the legality of this.

Another vampire player death shrieked my gobbos who were in combat by flying his terrorgheist behind the zombies they were in combat with and shrieking them in his shooting phase.

Now at first I thought this was obviously not a legal move...but he patiently showed me (using the Vamp book) that the Shriek is a "special attack" done in the shooting phase (so not actually a shooting attack and therefore not limited by those rules...it just happens in that phase)
It requires these things to target a unit
-May have marched, charged, or be engaged in combat
-Range of 8"
-Needs Line of Sight
-If the terrorgheist is engaged in combat, its death shriek MAY target a unit in base contact.
Then it goes on to explain how shriek damages.

So we asked the questions. "Did Terrorgheist March? Yes....Is the Terrorgheist within 8" Yes....Does the Terrorgheist have line of sight to the goblins?
Yes...."
"Ok then I can shriek your gobbos in the shooting phase with this special attack because I have met all the criteria for using it."

Also because of the "MAY target a unit in base contact" line he believes you can actually shriek OUT of combat if you can still meet all the criteria.

I had to agree (although I bet it will be FAQed different if they ever get off their butts and do it!?)....what are your thoughts on this?

-Static

This post has been edited by staticelf on Jun 19 2012, 06:49 PM

He is quite right. It's really horrible, Terrorgheists are incredibly strong.

Pack double lobbas, doom divers and perhaps even chukkas

its horrible I agree when playing against them...but now that I realize I was playing it wrong I will be dropping my Vargulfs for Terrorgheists now in my vamp list.

This post has been edited by staticelf on Jun 19 2012, 06:50 PM

Wait, from what I read it sounds like he shrieked into a combat he wasn't in though? You say he shrieked at a NG unit in combat with the zombies? He can only target them if he's in base combat with them, otherwise according to the rulebook, you can't target units in combat! Unless it says specifically you can target a unit engaged in combat (like a spell says it can be etc) then I'd say the general rule is that you can't do it, special attack or not. Unless I read it wrong and it's not what happened at all.

No, it's quite right. A terrorgheist may scream into a combat it's not a part of.

What does the shriek do? But Im kindve with Spawn Man here, I didnt think you could target a model in close combat at all unless stated otherwise.

Arfa da Grate

You can't with normal shooting attacks. However, the shriek is a special attack and follows its own rules, which were stated above.

Basically, you roll 2d6 and add the Terrorgheists remaining wounds. The difference between that number and your Ld is the amount of wounds you take without any armor save.

I saying no it can not. No where does it say that you can target something in close combat. Other rules that allow it does state it. It only allows in CC if its engaged.

With normal shooting you are specifically told you can't shoot into combat under the choose a target section.

With magic you are specifically told you can't target units engaged in combat under the choose a target section.

The shriek is not a shooting attack or a magic attack, it has it's own targeting restrictions and none of those state you can't shoot into combat.

It's pretty clear cut.

This post has been edited by carpet on Jun 20 2012, 12:08 PM

So they can also shriek to the rear?

No, the description says that you need line of sight...

But I didn't know that he can shriek in a combat hes not part of or shriek outside of combat though...

Hold on a tick, can't have it both ways. You can't target units in combat. If the beastie can target units in base contact, then it is a weapon/power that 'targets'. You can't target units in combat.

As to shooting out of combat, I would take it that the 'may' there is you may use it on a unit in base contact, or you may choose not to use it.

I could be wrong...

RoV

I think that if you actually read the Terrorgheist Death Shriek rules than it appears to be legal.

I think RoV (and myself of course! ) have it correct. Every other rule, magic, shooting or NOT that I've seen has it specifically specified specifically that you CAN target a unit in combat. If the rules the OP has stated above are all that it is, it does NOT say you can target a unit in combat - but you can if you are in base contact with the unit.

So it doesn't say you CAN target an engaged unit you're not in combat with, and it also doesn't say you CAN'T target an engaged unit you're not in combat with. So therefore we rely on common sense, and every other attack that allows you to target into combat has a rule stating that you can (at least every rule I've seen in any case). The absence of this statement from the model's rules does not mean it gives free reign.

It only talks about being engaged in combat. The fact it says target should mean we take the rules for targeting with every other attack (like RoV says) in the BRB and apply it to this. You cannot target into a combat you're not in. The rules say the attack targets.

If they are quoted incorrectly in the OP then please let us know what is different

RoV