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 How Large Are Your Warhammer Battles?, Preparing to design a Warhammer Campaign
nevets2021
Posted: May 1 2012, 10:39 PM


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Hello all, I am currently designing the story and battles to be included in a campaign.
However, I am having serious issues in trying to figure out the maximum point value per side in the latter battles.

Right now I am feeling the absolute maximum for my campaign should be about 3000 points per side.

Anything that goes over 3000 points I feel becomes just to much of a logistics issue, as well as a loss of tactics due to armies stretching from edge to edge, and being large enough to just have a no holds bar slug match.

Anyway though, what do you guys feel is just the right point level for a standard to large battle?
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Morkmillian
Posted: May 1 2012, 11:09 PM


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bigger the better!!

a lot of the time tho i find say the differance between a 2.5k and a 3k battle isnt all that big.

its usually making a couple units larger adding a character or magic items that you just couldnt squeeze in a 2.5k game and then adding a couple extra units which are usuallyi warmachines or a unit you wanted but couldnt fit due to point restrictions.

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Groznit Goregut
Posted: May 2 2012, 02:49 AM


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Can you have different sized games? Either let the opponents pick, or perhaps it's an escalating league? Maybe 1k at first and then upgrade to 2k. Go back to 1k for another skirmish and end up with a big 3k fight?

Or, if it's suppose to be map based and such....I can see that you need to pick points. Hmmm.....do you want everyone to have the toys? Or force them to make the hard choices? I would say 2400-2500 is average. 3k gives everyone all the toys. 2000 pts makes it tight and people will not be able to take everything that they want. I have to admit that those points levels kind of intrigue me as you have less of the cookie cutter builds.

Can you change your list between games? Or stick with the same list?
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nevets2021
Posted: May 2 2012, 03:35 AM


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QUOTE (Groznit Goregut @ May 2 2012, 02:49 AM)
Or, if it's suppose to be map based and such....I can see that you need to pick points.  Hmmm.....do you want everyone to have the toys?  Or force them to make the hard choices?  I would say 2400-2500 is average.  3k gives everyone all the toys.  2000 pts makes it tight and people will not be able to take everything that they want.  I have to admit that those points levels kind of intrigue me as you have less of the cookie cutter builds.

Can you change your list between games?  Or stick with the same list?

Well it really depends on the information i can squeeze out of you guys laugh.gif

The campaign which I envisioned would not be map base, but more like a open narrative campaign. The players will only be presented with the events leading up to the battle, the forced conditions of the battle, and then they will have to decide what units to include in their list to best ensure victory.

For instance say you get defend the watch tower scenario, and its a 1.5k vs 1.5k game, and you are forced to take a lvl 4 Wizz character due to the fact that the plot demands it. Now besides being forced to take the wizzard, you can decide everything else, such as wargear for him, lores etc. Then in addition you also have the choice of what units to include ( all lists in addition must follow any restrictions from the WHFB 8th rulebook).

I thought this would be interesting for having a 1.5k game and forcing a huge point sink at the get go because it would really put some foresight into how to make the list function to the best of its ability. (of course huge points sinks and expensive character will not be the only things presented over the course of the campaign)


Oh and lastly, going back to the scenario I presented above, the winner of the battle would get to decide what happens after, such as slaughter all the prisoners, execute the lvl 4 wizzard, let them go, etc.

Then the fun happens later in the campaign where the players find out how their choices, and performance throughout the campaign impacts the overall story.

tldr: I want people to design lists where they have to make the hard choices and assume that the lives of their characters and their entire armies and nations are on the line. Cause they are


wink.gif
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Snikpik
Posted: May 2 2012, 04:06 AM


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If I ran a campaign I wouldn't keep it as straight battles of set sizes. In fact I would add some variables which I would try to make as random as possible. I would also like to add in some kind of scenarios where hero characters might go off on a small adventure (Mordheim style). This could be used to help boost character levels and equipment and add an extra dimension to the campaign. You could limit magic weapons at the start of the campaign and have it that any used are ones obtained during the campaign. You could also add in some narrative or help the campaign along a bit with a story. As for the battles, you can incoporate smaller skirmishes as well as a prelude to some battles, or simply a way for one opponent to avoid another (if they get lucky enough that is). However 2500 is a pretty decent sized game.

This post has been edited by Snikpik on May 2 2012, 04:08 AM
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theorox
Posted: May 2 2012, 06:35 AM


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We only really play up to 3000 points...I'd like to play a really large game some time though. smile.gif

Theo
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Wechselbalg
Posted: May 2 2012, 11:31 AM


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Playing really large battles means you need really big tables but that´s it.
Back in 6th we played 15k points battles with 3 players on each side two to three times a year. Took us a whole weekend but was funny. Since then I never played battles with more than 3k points. sad.gif
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WarbossKurgan
Posted: May 2 2012, 12:58 PM


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QUOTE (Snikpik @ May 2 2012, 04:06 AM)
If I ran a campaign I wouldn't keep it as straight battles of set sizes. In fact I would add some variables which I would try to make as random as possible. I would also like to add in some kind of scenarios where hero characters might go off on a small adventure (Mordheim style). This could be used to help boost character levels and equipment and add an extra dimension to the campaign. 

This! ^

If you are running the campaign as a narrative then there should be as many different size games as you can manage! (And as many different scenarios too!) Everything from 100 point a side Mordheim style skirmishes to epic Storm of Magic "bring everything you own!" games. You could even include mis-matched games were one side has more points than the other.
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nevets2021
Posted: May 2 2012, 04:57 PM


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QUOTE (WarbossKurgan @ May 2 2012, 12:58 PM)
If you are running the campaign as a narrative then there should be as many different size games as you can manage! (And as many different scenarios too!) Everything from 100 point a side Mordheim style skirmishes to epic Storm of Magic "bring everything you own!" games. You could even include mis-matched games were one side has more points than the other.

I was considering having a few small Mordheim style/Warband games throughout the campaign aswell smile.gif

Something like a small special operations group tasked with preforming sabotage missions, raid against the enemies camp, assasinations, and distractions.

Mis-matched games I was considering also, but how big of a mis-match is the real issue.

Though the opportunity of designing scenarios where the reargaurd has to hold back the main enemy force long enough for a retreat does seem pretty exciting biggrin.gif

Lastly though is campaign length, I feel that perhaps nine battles ranging from 1000 points and the absolute maximum 4000 points (for the really big important fights) would be just right without the whole thing becoming very redundant.
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Wechselbalg
Posted: May 2 2012, 07:53 PM


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I think that depends on your setting.
Back in the days I played a rts pc game called "combat mission" there you had some scenarios where you were unable to win in the battle but you were able to win by points. For warhammer that would mean, you have a small force of defenders who have to hold a pass/gate/hill or sth like that for a couple rounds. You wont be able to destroy the attacking force but maybe you´re able to hold.
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farsighted
Posted: May 2 2012, 10:10 PM


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I Really like playing 3000 point games. We tend to play more 2500 point games than anything. I wouldn't know how to work a campaign as though. I've never participated in one.
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nevets2021
Posted: May 3 2012, 04:03 AM


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Sounding like 2.5k-3k is the standard, which is good smile.gif

Thanks everyone who has put in their twocents.gif

@farsighted
That is a shame, you should really try to do one in your gaming group, or with your close friends!

Maybe you (or for the matter everyone here) can participate in the campaign I am designing biggrin.gif

If anyone has any more ideas I would greatly appreciate it if you shared.

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TheAlternate
Posted: May 3 2012, 07:26 AM


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Well considering the tournaments around here are either 1500 or 2250,that is the number i focus on with my friends aswell. Going smaller when someone brings his newest army.

Might be cool to check how much your friends have available, or just ' prepare' yourself for upcoming tournaments and set the same number as those.
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