Got tips and strategies that work well against the Ogre Kingdoms? Share them here with other warlords! Since the release of the new 8th edition, the game has changed a great deal and new tactics must be developed and discussed in order for da greenskins to crump ‘em good!

Anyone fight Ogres lately? I've got a game tonight against someone who is the best player in the area.

I have no personal experience but I've heard saying block of ng with fanatics and nets and blast at them with chukkaz for the D3 wounds...

good luck!

Here's a place where chukkas are good!

For 2k i'd go Cheap Greatshaman+Cheap Warboss+ BSB, some large units of orcs and NG's with nets and fanatics, 4+ chukkas, a Doomdiver or two and maybe a lobba for the Gnobbos.

Theo

I also play them against a good opponent but am winning in the kickin stakes.

Magic, hit the magic users. Their spells that cause panic are not good agains NG
Morcs spirit totum means you will pretty much shut out most of their spells as they can only cast on 2 dice. Mork wants ya and things that do high strength damage are good.

Warmachines, I take stonethrowers to hit scrap launchers which with the large template on top of 50NG with their protective black capes is not good. Iron curse icon is good. They can also be used to snipe characters as some will fail the look out sir roll. Spear chuckers into units are not good for their side either due to the D3 wounds escpecially if hit in the flank.

Troops, NG in blocks of 50 with S&S and Warboss/Big Boss with Crown of Command will wear them down and hold them up whilst you hit them in the side with chariots S Herds etc. Def max out on Fanatics in units once got a unit of 30 ogres charging a unit of NG Spears flanked by 2 units of NG bows, relesed 9 fanatics and managed to get them top park on top of 7 of them and ran through them with another 1 I think 4 survived and were beaten down after a couple of rounds.

Trolls and Giant, I stopped using Trolls as the ogres are better escopecially with characters and Magic Weapons. Giant has done well but got hit by 40 gnoblars throwing their pots and pans at it.

Other considerations, Magic items that cause flaming hits are good to counter their regen. BSB with Banner of eternal flame. Weapons that increase characters strength. Chariots are good to get round the enemy as they will have so few troops.

I am not experienced enough to play tournament lists but have much more success when I can tailor a list to take on a particular oponent.

Would be good to hear if you bash em

Well, it's part of a league and I have a fixed list.

2500 Pts - Orcs & Goblins Roster

HEROES
Black Orc Warboss
(Ulags Akk'rit Axe, Dragonhelm, Talisman of Preservation, The Other Trickster's Shard)
Orc Great Shaman
(Staff of Sorcery, Warboss Umm's Best Big Boss's 'At)
Black Orc Big Boss (Battle Standard Bearer)
(Armour of Destiny)
Night Goblin Shaman (Level 2)
(Staff of Sneaky Stealin')

CORE
30 Night Goblins (fulll comand, nets)
2 Fanatics
30 Night Goblins (fulll comand, nets)
1 Fanatics
20 Night Goblins (full command, short bows)
1 Fanatics
25 Orc Big'Uns @ 330 pts (full command; Shield)
1 Mork's Spirit Totem
5 Forest Goblin Spider Riders (musician)

SPECIAL
2 x Goblin Rock Lobber w/ bully

RARE
6 Trolls
Goblin Doom Diver Catapult
2 x Snotling Pump Wagon
Giant

Looks like I will do the same-same. Put the NG up front with the trolls. Use war machines to try to take out the Scraplauncha. Use my fast cav to get up there and try to bait it into a charge, too. Not sure what the giant is going to do. Maybe go after the launcha, too? Or hunt after the little guys. They aren't so good vs. ogres. Maybe save him for a flank charge? Also, use my magic to try to get ASF and try to kill those buggers! Nets will be good. Stay Steadfast and the Warlord near.

I'll be playing Watchtower. Are their greenskins Core? Otherwise he can't have a unit in the tower.

Spear Chukka's are quite decent for use against ogre's. Generally a 2+ and 3+ to wound, with fairly decent chance to kill one Ogre per spear chukka (2-4 wounds). A pair of chukka's for overlapping fire power/offset misses.




Watch out for lead belchers, they can mow through a unit quickly.




NETS! NETS! NETS! NETS! NETS!

Since nets take effect BEFORE all impact hits, you can help minimize the effects of the bull charge/regular CC hits/Stomps the ogre's will put into you.


You'll likely stay steadfast for most fights, just watch for being flanked. Flank him if possible.

Source for this please? Nets have never affected Impact Hits and from what I know, nothing's changed about their rules?

Also, Impact hits are easy to avoid, if he's within charge range just walk your units up so you're 5" away and he won't get any impact hits.

Fanatics and Mangler Squigs are the bane of Ogre Kingdoms, people rarely play any shooting with Ogres. I myself play 4x maneaters with brace of handguns (because it's awesome) but I don't know anyone playing with leadbelchers as their misfire hurts them so bad.

Hi guys,

I'm one of the moderation team over at the ogre stronghold. I'm a long time ogre player and have played over 50 games with them in 8th edition as well as countless games beforehand.

Some chat about what's above first:

Nets did go before impact hits, inhibiting the bull charge, but few ogre generals rely or even hope to get these. I'd have to read the new book again to see if nets still work as they did, however.

Leadbelchers are rarely used by ogre players as they are rather unreliable. Instead I'd be aware of the ogre scraplaunchers which, since 8th, have been excellent. Dropping a large template at S3 and killing blow can take huge chunks out of units. Even of orcs. They a then a T5 S5 fear causing chariot with 5 wounds. Very useful and often run in pairs.

Gnoblars are indeed core and at only 2 points a model they can really tar pit things at little cost.

Nastiest though is the new ogre deathstar unit....this is something to fear, but it's not impossible to beat if you are careful and good. I'll get into the details about it later as I have to go offline for a while now.

With the new book the killer against Ogres is the Gork's Warpath. Cast is with 6 dice (with a Power Scroll if you want to go :cheese: ) and stomp the opponent's Bulls to death (Ironguts might have the Rune Maw). The template can hit 8 Ogres if I remember correctly, all cause Str6 hit with D3 wounds. After the first stomp, it comes again with 4+. It's insane, try it out.

- Cheers, Skarsnik. :D

The 7th ed Army Book faq said that nets take effect before Impact hits. I'll have to double check with the 8th ed Army Book (and the faq when it comes out).

How does one beat the Ogre character wall? By this I mean a unit of ogres whose entire front rank of three is composed of characters. Meaning you must divy up all attacks and deal with high toughness, wounds and magic items. The only idea I have had so far is to throw a unit of big uns at them with the a warboss who has the sword of anti-heroes but even then it comes down to some lucky rolls.

Thoughts?

Great guy I had an amazing game with had a unit like this.

If I remember

General
Butcher
BSB
Another hero
About 9 Ogres

Ha Ha, the foot will get rid of that.

Of course he had the banner that redirects magic attacks.

In the end I avoided it apart from taking some pot shots with lobbers and DD, and managed a draw.

It was Watch Tower in a Tourney that gave extra points, he was a bit cagey about going in due to my stone throwers so I managed and that gave me loads of points.

To answer, lucky hits from DD and RL then impact hits and mangler/fanatics would be my way if of course they oblige by lining up nicely.

Here's the list of units and special rules I posted in Green Bad Ugly's thread in the tactics section, this time having the book with me AND enough time on my hands (due to a minor injury, no worries!):

Ogre Charge: when charging, causes 1 impact per ogre in the front rank. If you roll 10+ on a charge roll, they cause d3 impact hits instead. Oh, and they add their rank bonus to the S of their impact hits just like Tombking chariot units.

Ironfist: Counts now ONLY as a shield and gives a parry save even when mounted (I thought you 'd get that anyways these days...)

Gut magic: works now like normal magic. mainly support spells & 1 maw spell, that deals minor damage even on a miss (I-check!) Spells no longer have silly sideeffects and the Bloodgruel spell has become the Lore Attribute. Basic lore spell makes units stubborn!

Of all the special Gnoblars, only the Lookout Gnoblars have survived through 7th ed. The others (Luck, Sword, and Tooth Gnobs) got stomped, eaten or whatnot during the long winter...

There's a few quirky weapons around: The Brace of handguns got streamlined for 8th ed use and are still deadly, even more so in the hands of 8th ed's Maneaters. The Harpoon thing is longer a Boltthrower, and there's a few other quirky weapons (a 6'' S6 killing blow beartrap-onna-chain, big javelins for the Hunter and a birdie with S 4 and 36'' range)

Onto the units (basic equipment in brackets):

Lords/Heroes:

Tyrant/Bruiser (light armour): Respectable in their own right, and easily tooled up for specific jobs. The Tyrant will probably skipped for a spellcaster lord these days, but still packs a nasty punch.

Slaughtermaster/Butcher: Access to Gut Magic and 3 more lores (Death, Beasts, Heavens)! They can be the army's general now, so you can expect to encounter Slaughtermaster very often. They can have ironfists, so some 'd say that they can also wear magic armour as well.

Firebelly: Breathweapon, flaming attacks, partially immune to flaming attacks, lore of fire spellcaster. Need I say more?

Hunter: As usual, but can ride a stonehorn now.

On a sidenote: Big Names are still available, but in contrast to some cheese-fest armies, they are bought from the magic item allowance. A few are limited to Tyrants or hunters.

Core:

Ogres, formerly known as Bulls (light armour):
they can either have ironfists or additional hws, so they 'll be either an anvil that hits back or a hammer against light and medium infantry.

Ironguts (greatweapons, heavy armor, option for a magic banner):
an break all things heavy if used in mass. Rather wasted againszt tarpits(like Goblin hordes). However, low Ogre Initiative means that they don't loose much from striking last with their gws.

Gnoblars (handweapon, throwing weapon):
The Ogres' Goblins, only weaker (S2, I2, Ld 5) and slightly cheaper... They come equipped with throwing weapons (at S2) and may cause a dangerous terrain test for every model in an unit charging them if upgraded to trappers. Don't cause panic checks even in other Gnoblars. Oh, they can have a full command now.

Elite:

Leadbelchers (cannons, light armor):
Now a viable choice, they get d6 shots per model that ignore penalties for multiple shots and movement, resulting in S4 AP attacks at handgun ranges (I think). Can't stand and shoot, but move and shoot.

Man-Eaters (light armour, all equipment for Ogres available to them, option for a magic banner):
Points costs were nearly halved in this edition. Each unit can have differently equipped troopers, heavy armour, and 1 can have a magic banner. During Army selection, the Ogre Player can pick 2 special rules from a list (consisting of poison attacks, sniper, stubborn, ItP, fast movement, vanguard, scouts, and strider) and give them to this unit. BUT: Each special ability can only be picked once per army, so it can't include 2 units that are ItP or Stubborn.
Still, due to this versatility, they 're amongst the best in the new army book. Their stats are more than decent (think typical Ogre stats, nearly all of them +1!), their equipment choices allow you to attempt to a variety of situations, even in a single unit. Luckily, Maneaters are not longer a "Each model is its own Champion"-type of unit. Still, they get full command now, making them definitely a lot more deadlier.

Yethis (handweapon, frostaura):
Have fast movement and magic attacks and cause -1 to enemy WS. Alas, no more Strider ability and have become flammable! They do have a nasty I of 4, mind.

Mournfang Cavalry (light armor, option for a magic banner):
Nasty beasts that deal d3 impact hits on a charge at S5 (in addition to 4 Ws 3+ S 5 attack per beast), and gain an AS bonus like our boars. And they have an Ogre on top to boot! Said riders can have heavy armour and either ironfists (so they can have an AS of 2+ and PARRY!) or greatweapons.
Having spied around in the Ogre Stronghold, I 'd say they are rated even better than the Maneaters due to their AS and ability to parry in melee. However, low points are their Ws of 3 and Ld of 7. Mind you, I see some merit in boltthrowers now.

Gorger:
Unbreakable, frenzied beast that uses ambush rules and has killing blow. Makes a halfway decent speedbump. Making it lose Frenzy hampers its performance (-1A), so ye'll find it skipped in favour of the new bih players on the block.

Sabretooths:
Now available without a Hunter, but profit from his presence (gain vanguard if Hunter joins them) BUT never use the General's or BSB's special abilities. Currently being used as 1 or 2 strong throwaway units (e.g. Fanatic, mangler counter) as far as I gathered.

Rare:
In general, their warmachines are tough beasties - literally! - and double as chariots, but without scythed wheels. Their 2 big warbeasts such as the Thundertusk double as warmachines to some extent...

Giant:
Finally streamlined with the rest of the breed, so you know what to expect.

Scraplauncher:
As usual. Killing Blow is a bit erratic, but useful. Insert-funny-anecdote here!

Ironblaster:
A cannon pulled by a rhinox, which has less range and can move and shoot, but rolls twice for a bounce (the cannon not the rhinox). And the grapeshot does S 10 damage.

Stonehorn:
This thing can serve as a Hunter's mount and allows them to ignore move or shoot if equipped with the Harpoon launcher thingy, but that's a mere sidenote. It deals a boatload of impact hits on a charge, but can't attack normally. All "multiple Wound"-damage is halved, so this is one though beastie.

Thundertusk:
Jack of all trades, master of none. 2 Ogre Riders, less AS than the previous monster, and a few ranged attacks in the shape of the beartrap thing, the harpoonthrower and a sort of Frost-Thrower that can't misfire. Also, causes enemies in 6'' to always strike last.

____________

My own first performance with the new book was quite respectable, but 'tis a tale for another day (and subforum)! I 'll leave my musings on how to beat them for later, but I think Orcs&Goblins can bank on superior nummers and being adept at the shocktroop style of play as well.

Also, as I said in the other thread, Savage Orc Big Uns should be able to handle a lot of Ogre units them with ease, having the same number of attacks with a smaller base and a wardsave of 5+ to counter what attacks are left. Trolls can counter their Ironguts and impact hits might help here as well.

Can I add a little value here?

We played a 1000pt game after a long 2500er, which I won ^_^

Anyway, this smaller game, I kept my 38 SO biguns that I used in the bigger game.

Immune to Psyc, be careful, a lot of what we have is immune. Ogres with high M love it, multi charge is dangerous.

Needless to say, turn 2, I got off ere we go (the only spell my Lvl1 with shrunken head rolled for), charge by a stonehorn, 5 IG with FB and 4 MF in the flank, with 3 in contact. He got off Global +1 S.

Wow, the SO were awesome. I lost about 10 through impacts. Then strike in I order. I still had maximum effectiveness (well almost). 40+ hits with reroll= 5 dead IG and dead stonehorn. Won by about 7.

Moral is, go deep, soak up the impacts, they will (8/10) get the charge on you. So careful you dont open yourself to multicharge with your ITP.

Also, how about a character with terrifying mask of EEE to charge all those pesky Ld4 Sabretusks? Can work eh. Question is, do they have to check for terror if they already cause fear? Or is that in CC only?

Thanks

A model that causes fear only treats models that cause terror as causing fear. So basically that means they won't test for terror when you charge them, but they will test for fear each turn of the combat.

OK, thanks for that. Shame though^^

Mangler Squigs TEAR UP Ogres. Fanatics are good but less so.

SabreTusks are made for popping manglers or drawing out fanatics. Ironblasters are good vs. Manglers too. Just sayin.

Hi guys . I have unfortunately attracted the

attention of an ogre player .

So I'm Gunna need tacticw to beat em. So its been watching him and it looks like he is using

leadbelchers normal ogres and a giant . He

uses loads of leadbelfhers and I need tactics . But mainly I don't know.how to take down his darn giant. Do you think ky arachnarok could take it. Need my army list Night goblin shaman Savage orc shaman Night goblin big boss

2X units of ten artery boyz full command 30 artery boyz light armour full command 10 spider riders spears and bows full command 30 night goblin spearmen fanatics netters and full command 20 night goblins with bows full command . Rock lobber (using old codex. We have agreed ) Arachnarok flinger . Would I be able to fry the giant with magic or ...

As usual, the answer is Savage Orcs. That's the one thing Ogres just can't run over in the O&G army. The Giant you can hunt down with Black Orcs, Mangler Squigs, or even Chariots (2D6+2 S5 hits hurt a lot).

You could also throw a minimally sized unit of squig herders at a Giant. if you had 4 squigs in the front rank then that's 8 attacks that hit on 3's and wound on 4's. If you don't win then the hits you get for squigs go wild should definitely finish him off.

Are fanatics any good against em

Fanatics are real good when the Ogres charge you, but a canny Ogre player will draw them out with one of his cheap cats.

Take the cats out with Doom Divers and bring the Fanatics anyway.

What about Spear Chukkas? I'm thinking that with the Ogres and now Demi-Griffon Knights, I'm thinking that Spear Chukkas can do well here. Sure, they don't hit much, but they are cheap and can pour out the fire. Avoiding armor saves is good against their cav.

how do we deal with greedy fist + death magic??

agreed. They might really work well against mournfang and demibirds. Considering their price tag, they should be able to earn they points back... I usually take two these days, simply because it's expendable shooting. It often means that his chaff will target those, other than redirecting units. Other than that, their shots are so "cheap", that you can easily take the change and try to hit lone characters, or just start peal of knight, even if their are no ranks to penetrate. It's still well worth the shot.

Wolfs actually work well against Leadbelchers since they can't stand and shoot and don't get stomps.

If you bring spears, shields + banner you can actually win against 3 LB.

Characters on wolf with 3+ armor and spear also get 3 Str 5 attacks (just don't fail that fear check!)


-The other day I brough 10 wolfs with spears+shields+banner, vanguarded up, he got first turn and shot at my mangler (long range, hitting on sixes), because honestly who cares about wolves? I then charged his 4 LB with 10 Str4 attacks and 5 str 3, got in 2 wounds, he got 3 back, I had banner + charge, he failed ld 6 and I ran him down.

I don't think I was that lucky, this outcome is actually quite probable.

u know u cant charge when u vangaurd right?

Only when you've got the first turn. The opponent started first, so it's ok to charge.

i think by turn 1 they mean the whole turn 1 not just the player that starts :S

Naw, if you go second, you can charge.

Anyone tried the Spear Chukkas against Mournfang yet?

Had a matchup with an Ogre player today... he was running 2 units of mournfang, the gutstar and 2 ironblasters.
Trolls are one of our best defenses against mournfang... my unit of 8 chewed through them in short order... vomit and the regen is just made to counter them.
Savage Orcs did pretty well too... in the end the gutstar and 4 mournfang were too much for them, but only just
The key to fighting ogres is to disrupt the combo charges... make sure you get rid of his redirectors so that you can control the movement phases and oddly, you need to be patient... it's worth losing a turn or two of seemingly forward movement to avoid a fight when they are buffed... having said that, the mournfang my trolls were fighting had wystans wildform on and they still lost :)

Well i recently just went against some ogres, basically i had a bloc bus to hold up some of smaller units of ogres, or just other units in general of ogres, from my main unit of a 35 SOs with bows, a blorc warboss (decked out of course), a lvl 2 orc shaman with shrunken head, lvl 4 NG shaman with scroll, and goblin BSB with poison banner. Yeah with 5+ poison on shooting i got an average of seven wounds every shooting phase (of course with some saved but not many on his 6+). when the untouched SO unit, big uns mind you, got into combat with the remaining 3 bulls and a general left of his 11 man original unit, i crushed them and chased the general down. My rock lobber, manglers, and chukkas went after his stone horn, and units. And when i felt comfortable i went after his iron cannon thing. My wolf riders rode around the mournfang and were fantastic at distracting them and then went after his leadbelchers. the point is shoot in magic along with one very fighty unit to fight off the onslaught, hand to hand like true orcs, will work very well.
PS after six turns a 1 fleeing leadbelcher with 2 wounds on him and his iron cannon (rendered useless by his misfire) with 1 wound, i think, was left on the table.