Zelda vs Malon, Comparing the two

I said it in the other thread and I'll say it here: what if he just wanted Epona? He can't get her without having to deal with Malon. Even with Epona's song in MM, the commentary above the song ( which usually denotes the song's function) says: " The horse really seems to like this song" before noting that "It's Epona's Song! The Song of two who are bound by trust". In contrast, the line above the Song of Time is "This reminds me of us" followed by "...This is a song of memories of Princess Zelda." My point is that it's function with Epona's song, sentimentality with Zelda's.

Okay, so the dealing with Malon is optional whereas with Zelda it's not: but in the end, when Link IS free to do as he pleases...he chooses to go see Zelda, and that's where the game ends. It's a matter of perspective, but to me it seems he desires Zelda, whereas with Malon, she desires him. Just because he had to see Zelda doesn't mean he didn't want to ( in fact the game pointed out he did. )

My honest opinion is that ZeLink was the intended couple....but MaLink is a valid option, as per the dev's wishes. We wouldn't have been given the chance to say "Yes", or been told that Link could get used to this otherwise. ( Cremia's hug, italics mine. )

Alright, well there is actually something else that is an "optional" encounter with Zelda, which would be dependant of Link's own free will. When you are able to borrow masks, before you obtain the final spiritual stone, you are able to return to the courtyard to meet with Zelda. If you wear different masks, she has a different reaction, which portrays the fact they are comfortable with one another and enjoy one's company; Link is enthusiastic about showing her the masks and she is having fun observing them. Now, although it may seem minor, it allows us to see their relationship in another light; if he was simply driven because of obligation Link would not waste his time by playing with her (which, btw, is why Link is seen playing with Zelda in the manga). Another point I would like to bring up is the official manga, though it is not canon with all of the events within the game, reveals even more evidence that supports Link and Zelda. It also recieved the approval of Nintendo and was marked as something official; if there were any conflicts pertaining to the ZeLink within the story, if they did not want fans to believe that there was something between the princess and the hero, Nintendo would not have published the "fan-made" story. Obviously the main themes, concepts, and characters were up to par, conveying the same messages that they had hoped gamers would derrive from the game itself.

It's also said that Aonuma ( the current head of the Zelda development section ) was the consultant on all the Akira Himekawa mangas. I don't think you could get a more accurate representation of what the dev's think other than him: his support is major. I doubt he would allow something so blatantly out of the spirit of the games to receive his approval.

And I agree: it's true, you can visit Zelda as many times as you want before she disappears. I loved her reaction to the Skull Mask: "I'd bet it must be fun to sneak around pretending you are a monster"....is that the reaction of a no-nonsense, totally business Princess? Nope. I'd bet she can be a real trouble maker on her own as well as quite the tomboy.

Malon in contrast, I believe one of her reactions to a mask ( Spooky one? ) was: "Oh brother. Boys will be boys!" With her, it's hard to forget that she's a pretty girl who is possibly interested in Link. Romance before friendship, as with Zelda, it's friends first, romance later.

Some may argue that "casual pals" as children who are a boy and a girl often go nowhere as the guy sees the girl as "one of the boys"...but more often than not the guy grows up and falls hideously in love with the girl. That's how I see Link and Zelda...where solid friendship and attraction from Link grow into deep and fulfilling love. I see Malon as the girl who was crushing on him from the start, but really knew him no deeper.

I agree. I think it's Zelda's tomboy-ish side that attracts him to her; both seek adventure and would do anything in their power to stand up for what they believe in. Malon... doesn't seem to be very adventurous. Not like her father, anyway. She's more inclined to remain in the ranch; she would appear in other locations, otherwise.

The soldier who stands guard in front of the gate also helps to provide insight into Link's feelings towards Zelda, prior to meeting her (this is if you decide to pay instead of climbing up the cliff to gain entrance). The first time you ask him for entrance he declines, but the second time he starts to tease you about your "eagerness" to meet Zelda. Also, in the town market, Link hears about Zelda's beauty and personality talked about by many of the characters (note the fact that Link only tunes in to what he deems important when talking to village folk). Thus we are able to have an idea that Link was interested from the very beginning, even upon hearing rumours about the princess.

Btw, I loved watching Zelda's reactions, especially to the rabbit hood: ["You look like you have four ears!" *laughs*]

I don't think Malon's adventurous either. Other than a trip to town now and then likely for the purpose of socializing, she honestly seems content on the ranch. I've always felt Link would have more fun with Zelda, enjoy her more. With Malon, he can talk about/ride Epona or play along to the song....with Zelda, he tells her about his adventures ( MM is a legend eventually "held dearly" by the Royal Family ) and it's on his terms...an impression I never got with Malon.

What's the quote for that tease? I can't remember it.

To be fair..there's also people talking about Malon. "The ranch owner's daughter is cute"...but that doesn't point to much other than that the townspeople like Malon. ( and perhaps some developer ) Most of their other dialogue is that Lon Lon is a fun place to visit, etc. But really, all the female characters get talked about...go to Zora's domain after Jabu Jabu and the Zora's say that Ruto has been talking about him or such....the Kokiri tell you Saria is waiting for you. It's like Link is getting prodded towards different girls from all sides.

Zelda and Link are definately very compatible with one another. ^^ As far as the town folk, however, I was thinking along the lines that there were more people talking about Zelda, her personality and how beautiful she was, which is more than just "cute".

Man, I REALLY need to play Ocarina of Time again. With a new file (the second one or the third one; I never erase the first one), I'll be able to do the things that's being talked about now: talk to Zelda while wearing masks (though I think I'll only be able to use the Keaton Mask, the Skull Mask, and the Spooky Mask, because you can only sell the Bunny Hood to the Running Man after getting the three Spiritual Stones and the Ocarina of Time, I believe), talk to Malon while wearing masks, listen to the townspeople talk about Zelda and Malon, hear the gate guard tease Link about his "eagerness" to see Zelda, etc.

It really is a lot of fun, watching Zelda's reactions when you show her the masks. ^^ I remember loving her reaction to the bunny hood and the wooden mask.

I'm playing Ocarina of Time now, and the guard does decline Link's request to open the gate so he can see Zelda, but he doesn't tease Link about his wanting to see the Princess. The guard just remarks about Link wanting to go through the gate, then asks for ten Rupees before he opens the gate. Then, after the gate is open, all the guard will say if you talk to him is, "KEEP IT A SECRET FROM EVERYONE."

Does the guard tease Link about being eager to see Zelda at any time in the game?

Woo, this got really interesting while I was away! I'm deeply intrigued by the different viewpoints on Malon and Zelda- you both have very good, well thought out points. Though I personally go on the Zelda side myself. XD

I didn't know you could show Zelda the masks!!! D: Now I have to go replay OoT just so I can do that!!!

lol! Anyway, the soldier does tease you about Zelda; he mentions wanting to see Zelda and then says something to the effect: "You want in that badly? Well... Alright. But you have to pay me ten rupees! And don't tell anyone!"

And yep! You can show Zelda the masks. It's worth it, too! ^^

Yeah...try it on the other characters too. The Zora Mask with Ruto should get you an interesting reaction if I remember right too.

Ok..so more comparisons.

One thing that I've always noticed with all these comparisons between TP and OoT is how Ilia seems to be an amalgamation of Malon and Saria. But if we are taking facets from Ilia's personality, one that I would say undoubtably belongs to Malon is the bad temper...particularily how Ilia reacted to her father, and his perceived failing in her eyes. While Talon is a far cry from Ordon's responsible mayor, I was left with the impression that Malon possessed a volatile temper. The fact that Talon commented about having to wrangle Malon into a good mood confirmed this to me.

Zelda on the other hand...I think she's more likely to just get hurt and carry on behind her father's back than get angry at him. I say this because of how she reacts if Link doesn't believe her..she looks away, actually hurt. If Link won't keep her secret she looks half embarassed and hurt. In all this, I'm thinking that Zelda is likely more of an introvert when it comes to her feelings and reactions than Malon is.


Another topic: Earlier on, I said I thought Malon was shallow. I still do, but I think I've come to more of an idea what I meant.

I think because she's such an extrovert that connections she makes tend to be out in the open, more surface level than something with Zelda would be. When we are dealing with Link and Zelda, I've always felt because both keep their feelings to themselves in an extent, that much of their connection would be unsaid, yet strong all the while.

Another thing dealing with surface level? How Malon reacts to Link's appearance. She comments first on his clothing, than adopts a nickname based on his surface rather than calling him who he really is. I would think as Link found out he wasn't a Kokiri that hearing "fairy boy" may actually be painful for him, as it reminds him of his false identity. ( Though she does call him Link as an adult when she thanks him )

Zelda refers to him as both Link, and "Hero of Time" I don't think Hero of Time is a surface name, because in his heart that is who he really is, besides just Link. Overall, I feel that the connection Zelda made with him was at a far deeper level than anything Malon ever achieved.

I think I did actually show Ruto the Zora mask at one point. XD I vaugely recall that her reaction was rather interesting.

That is a good point- when Ilia scolds her father, it is strongly similar to how Malon acts about Talon's irresponsible behavior. I've always thought Malon had a bit of a temper- you know what they say about redheads! As Malon was, Ilia is also completely obsessed with Epona. She gets one little scratch and Ilia completely flips out on Link. It's like, gee, who's more important to her, the horse or the guy?

I think this is quite true. While Malon seems much more extroverted and shares herself freely, Zelda keeps things such as her feelings and emotions much more closely guarded, and she does seem to be more introverted. She doesn't have anyone to confide in besides Link and Impa- we see clearly that her father is not someone she feels she can go to with her troubles. Zelda is fairly isolated, and in the OoT manga she mentions how it was nice to spend the day as a normal child with Link while Malon is quite the opposite- she is free to roam and interact with so many people. Link like Zelda has been fairly cut off from the world at large- he spent most of his life growing up in the sheltered forest, and was pretty much ostracised by most of the Kokiri children.

The only problem with Ilia's resemblance to Malon is I have seen many shippers who take it as developer confirmation of the MaLink ship, or Ordon itself being proof it happened. But the problem is that Ilia was also Saria, and OoT Link I would say did have a thing for Saria...so it could just be echoing that, rather than after-the-fact inventing a MaLink relationship with OoT/MM Link. Ordon is also a subtle reference to the Kokiri Forest. Either way, I think Ilia ( and Malon and Saria ) would get caught by the same thing in the end: small girls in a small world: too small for Link.

I dislike stereotypes , but it's a fact she has a bad temper. As for Epona, I think that the same thing is in play with both Malon and Ilia...they love horses, but because their world is so small, small things are a big deal to them. Like small children...taking a toy away can be a huge deal because they have little else to think about. I'm not bashing Ilia and Malon with this, it's just they don't seem to have much else to concern them...maybe that's why they latch on/pay so much attention to Link. ( Which is got to be flattering to him)

With Zelda, it's the exact opposite: she has the entire world to think of, and her decisions will affect them and her people. I think she latches on to Link though because of the extreme loneliness she'd feel in this position, everyone serves her in a capacity...few are equals. I'm echoing in essence here what you said, but I agree about Link. Being the forest outcast and suddenly stumbling into such unconditional belief and acceptance has got to be comforting.

Malon herself seems accepting and such..but it's not exclusive in the way Zelda's is because Malon is so social...she didn't recognize him as an adult, yet treated him not too much differently than as a child..implying anyone would receive that treatment. Epona's Song may have been a special priviledge, but not her friendliness.

Back to my small vs big for a moment: Maybe another reason Malon was so interested in Link was that he'd essentially solve her problems. She gets the man she needs to marry and run the ranch for her. Zelda too needs a partner, but you know well that bigger things than romance are on her mind.

Well, I've talked to Zelda and Malon while wearing the Keaton Mask, the Skull Mask, the Spooky Mask, and the Bunny Hood, and I thought it be fun to draw conclusions based on the things they say.

When wearing the Keaton Mask, Zelda says: "What a cute little mouse! What? Oh, it's not a mouse?"
When wearing the Keaton Mask, Malon says: "Oh, I know that character! It's Keaton! He's very hot in Hyrule Castle Town right now!"

When wearing the Skull Mask, Zelda says: "It must be exciting to sneak past the guards while wearing that mask!"
When wearing the Skull Mask, Malon says: "Oh, brother! Boys will be boys!"

When wearing the Spooky Mask, Zelda says: "Wow, that makes your head look huge! Hee hee!"
When wearing the Spooky Mask, Malon says: "Hi, fairy boy! What? You think you're in disguise? But it's so obvious who you are!"

When wearing the Bunny Hood, Zelda says: "What are those floppy things on your head? Ears? That mask makes you look like you have four ears!"
When wearing the Bunny Hood, Malon says: "Hi, fairy boy! What? You think you're in disguise? But it's so obvious who you are!"

What conclusions can we draw from these quotes? Well, Zelda's quote while Link wears the Keaton Mask implies that she's been sheltered all her life, since she doesn't know the character Keaton. Malon, being not as sheltered, is excited over the popular Keaton Mask. Zelda is also capable of being a troublemaker, judging by her reaction to the Skull Mask, and has no problem with teasing Link (see her reactions to the Spooky Mask and the Bunny Hood).

Can anyone think of any more conclusions that we can draw from Zelda's and Malon's quotes?