Here's a topic that's had me thinking.

We're frequently talking about Zelda's competition in ZeLink discussions, so why not Link's? Zelda is beautiful, smart, compassionate and powerful...and probably the most desirable woman in all of Hyrule. She'd likely have many smitten men to choose from, the only thing stopping her would be the need to marry a man who could fit the role of her partner. ( I think Link would always win in a contest of quality )
So who could compete?

I can probably divide them into groups.

-Other royalty. Possible, but not likely. She couldn't marry a crown prince because she's in line to her own throne and I don't think Hyrule would merge with another kingdom. An ordinary non-ruling Prince could come from another country but I don't see her marrying royalty for the reason under nobility.

-Nobility. Probably the closest to her status other than other royalty. The plus side is they would obviously be familiar with etiquette and possibly subject management. But on the downside Zelda is often unconventional...a tomboy and humble. Neither strict protocol or pride would likely be terribly desirable in her eyes.

-Military. Probably a better option, I'm thinking more of a Knight rather than a mere palace guard. You'd find leadership here too, but most likely without the bad associated with some aristocracy. Zelda may feel more at home with someone like this: someone to fight alongside of who is as brave as her. They'd also understand duty.

-Commoners/Peasants. From random townspeople ( merchants, blacksmiths, etc ) to farmers and such. I see more negative that positive here though. She'd likely be too different and kept on a pedestal in their mind. Not to mention their leadership skills would likely be zero. As well as seeing the big picture.

-Palace Servants. Better than above possibly but still would probably be too much in awe of her to ever form an equal partnership.

So, thoughts? Obviously Link is the best for the job in most of our eyes, but I think overall the most danger to him would come from the military/nobility class...a man with both could be a formidable challenger. In cases where ZeLink is not really there ( TP ) I see her marrying a knight of noble blood, a brave man who is like Link, but more polished.

I think there was chemistry between Zelda and Link in TP, however, because that wasn't the main focus for the game, the storyline itself didn't seem to be shaped around the pair. TP has to be the game that has the most interactions with a variety of people, problems and conflicts included.

Anyway, as far as men for Zelda, it would really just depend on their character; it wouldn't matter what class they were from, so long as they had all of the mannerisms that she felt she desired. A peasant could very well be fit for Zelda, being that they would be kind, compassionate, and couragous since they are forced to endure more hardships than anyone else. They can still be leaders, but because of the position they were in it would be rather difficult to move up to a "higher class". The "classes" I really don't agree with, because what should matter is whether or not the two people connect, not whether or not they're able to relate to one another because of their classes. Technically Link is a commoner/peasant, and still he has risen to be among Zelda's first choice, so...

The one that Zelda would choose would be someone that was compassionate, understanding, selfless, loving, out-going, happy, pleasant, caring, couragous, strong (but at the same time, soft), humorous, etc.

AKA: Better than Link. Which I rather doubt...
OFF TOPIC:
I've been reading this fanfic that is still unfinished, and it's romance/drama, but it's really good, and not just some sappy love scenes put together at all... The best I've ever read... In this fanfic, there's this King named Ashton, who also wants Zelda. Personally, I think he's just a large pig with green eyes, but he was betrothed with Zelda when they were young.
ANYWAY!!!
Instead of spoiling you all, you can catch this fanfic by Clicking Here!

PS: IT'S REALLY GOOD!!! TRUST ME. :thumbs: I cried every once in a while because it's really sad, but I don't fully understand a couple of parts because I'm still a little too young to be able to define love... But not by that much!

I was just using classes to sort of separate the type of man...I mean his upbringing and what he does for a living would affect his ability to know how to rule a people. Some people are natural leaders but often it's something that's developed from potential. When I look at pairing for instance, pre-adventure TP Link with Zelda, I can't remotely see it working. All he knows are animals and Ordon. I couldn't expect hm to suddenly be able to handle what Zelda does everyday.
After the adventure however, I can see it. Mainly because he's spent months being "tutored" by another ruler. ( Midna ) She's talked about her people, her realm and such, all while she and Link save Hyrule. His leader's heart has been sparked...it would just need more work.

What are describing sounds pretty much like Link. I mean it's to be expected...I don't think a better matter exists for her.

I read one fanfic where Zelda was given a suitor I actually liked: http://www.fanfiction.net/s/4293825/3/Time_After_Time
( Ch 2, farther down the page )
While this writer came up with the reason of two Triforce pieces actually being the cause to separate Link and Zelda ( I don't agree, rather I think two in close proximity would guard against Ganon rather than summon him ) She did make someone I could handle. I thought this was a good example.

I still think that Link and Zelda would be compatible, despite there being a difference in their leadership skills. They would be able to compliment one another easily; one might be strong in one area and weaker in the other whereas the other would be weak in one area and stronger in another. You pretty much want someone with similar values but, at the same time, different. They have to bring something new into the relationship.

Yes, exactly. Different and yet the same. Link could join the military and ascend the ranks in order to get more respect from some people (if being the hero isn't enough).
Hylian Princess: I love that fanfic! It's really nice. I'm eagerly waiting unil the next chapter. Ingie made it so now I shall go bother her. Just kidding. I'll just wait patiently.

I know, Fortitude really got me going with fanfiction! I first didn't really understand what fanfiction was, but I'm glad I looked into it now! My member title is "Going fanfic crazy!"

I'm kinda upset that Ingie posted each chapter one after another... Now we have to wait. :sighs:
Not to spoil anything for anyone, but I have a feeling that this Shade they mention in the end is Vasilis, the old crook who sold Link and Hyrule on a silver platter. May the godesses guide Ingie to change what Vasilis has done, or make him regret it. Zelda smashed her vanity for godess'es sake! But, many people have said that Shade might just be Link himself, which could make sense... I guess we'll have to find out! :thumbs down:

Z-disguise, have you ever written fanfiction?

In the OOT Child Timeline, I see Zelda marrying a nobleman/knight only in the situation that Link leaves Hyrule Castle to be with Malon. Though I'm sure Link and Zelda would always maintain a close friendship and work as a team in uniting the TOW and the TOC to secure peace and stability throughout the kingdom of Hyrule. But if he chooses to stay by Zeldas side in Hyrule Castle then he has nothing to worry about.

In the Adult timeline its a no brainer. A time of peace means that Links heroics are no longer needed so more than likely he would settle into a simple lifestyle as a farmer with Malon and Zelda will likely marry a Hyrule nobleman.

In TP IMO Link and Zelda seem to be a very awkward and incompatible match. When I think of the unlikelyhood of a LinkxZelda in TP, I think about the scolding from Illia and the excitedly aroused look Link gets when the great fairy touches his cheek. If he allows himself to be a submissive doormat to an ugly duckling commoner like Illia, imagine how badly he will be comically dominated by Zelda. And if he gets that worked up when a strange looking fairy touches him, he would probably crap in his trousers and feint if Zelda did the same thing to him. I don't think Zelda would be interested in someone with Links personality, and she does not seem the type to give Link nurturing reassurance as OOT Zelda does to give Link the self confidence he needs to feel worthy of Zelda's love.

But I like to think TP Link would find true love with someone eventually. For now I can see two possibilities.

1. He eventually settles down with a common Hyrule town girl and Zelda marries a random Hyrule nobleman to keep the royal bloodline going. Yet Link and Zelda continue to have a cooperative business like working relationship as a hero/ruler team in uniting the TOC and TOW to maintain stability and order in Hyrule.

2. He resigns from the life of a hero, because Zelda doesn't appreciate his heroic deeds as much as he would want her to. Compounded by the likely heartbreak that its inevitable that she will choose a more qualified Hyrule nobleman to marry instead of him, so he goes crawling back to Ordon to be with Illia who will likely still be standing there on the same spot awaiting for Links return.

Personally I would prefer the former instead of the latter. Mainly because I hate Illia. :angry:
__________________
up.

Actually, with all the destruction that Ganondorf caused, it wouldn't be anything like a time of peace - it would be a time of rebuilding. The population would be severely reduced, Castle Town would have to be razed and rebuilt from the ground up, and the people who had managed to get away would have to be called back to help with the rebuilding.

And why would Link settle into the simple lifestyle of a farmer after his long fight? I have a friend that has just come home from two years in Iraq, and he says over and over he will never be the same again emotionally or mentally - his entire worldview has changed. I am not here to make a statement about Iraq or anything to do with it, but I DO want to make a strong statement that war is hell. What does this have to do with Link?

Link was a solider for a long while, even though he was not a soldier for as long as Zelda/Sheik was. He was forced to watch people being killed, do some killing himself, camp out on the fields, etc. It would take an incredibly strong woman to be able to handle the emotions that Link will at one time or another be forced to release. War is hell, and the families of soldiers (fictional or non-fictional) have to work together to support that soldier.

With that being said, I am going to simply state that Malon is not up to the task of emotionally supporting Link. Link is in an irreversible mental state, there is no going back. All Malon wants is a "knight in shining armor:" she doesn't necessarily want Link for who Link is or for who he has become - she just wants someone to be romantically attached to.

I think we can blame for the underactive writers at Nintendo. TP Link and Zelda had hints later in the game that might allow for a relationship (specifically, the scene on the glowing lake - that had a few connotations to it), but it definitely felt more MidnaxLink than anything else. Next.

Why does Link need to get self-confidence from Zelda? Really, why does he need self-confidence from any person besides himself? A true solider (or any person) gains self-confidence from his accomplishments, not from the praises of others. Granted, I think that Zelda praised him for his sacrifices for Hyrule, but I think that was the tip of the iceberg.

Oh I agree definitely about Hyrule needing to be rebuilt. But what does that have to do with it being mandatory that he has to be with Zelda for this to happen?? He can contribute rebuilding Hyrule being with Malon more so. Since its more logical that the commoners along the countryside are going to need the most help, it makes sense that he is living with Malon where he can be more useful in the rebuilding process. Zelda probably has engineers, soldiers and architects to help her rebuild the Castle and Hyrule Town, so she does not need Link in that department. Like I said, Link is way better off helping the people along the countryside of Hyrule near and around where Malon lives. And why do Zelda shippers always potray Malon as some narrow minded bimbo that can't support her man?? She lives in Hyrule too right?? Where does all this unecessary negativity about Malon's character come from?? To me she is the polar opposite of the Zelda shippers assumption that she can't love Link for who he is.

And I don't remember Link being identified as a soldier in OOT at all. Where are you getting this info from?? And once everything is rebuilt, what good would Link be in living a pathetic useless existence in Hyrule Castle. Remember, Link was in limbo for 7 years and is basically still a child mentally. There is no way he can contribute with the mature dignity needed to participate in the Hyrule Court, other than being a freakshow on display for all the nobles and royal subjects to laugh at. Besides how can a LinkxZelda happen when Link is in this state of mind?? Are you suggesting Zelda seduce him in his child like mental state?? I think not. As I said before, in the Adult Timeline, it boils down to the love interest more likely to show Link the birds and the bees to overcome his naive innocence. And its not Zelda for sure. So more likely the sacred and hallowed prize of Links treasured virginity would be won by Malon. Fairy included. :) So it makes perfect sense that Zelda sent him back to the Child Timeline because even she knew that Link and her would have never had a chance if he stayed.

But even in the Child Timeline, I still say Malon can still mold Link from cuddly cherub like forest child into the knight in shining armor she always dreamed about and ultimately steal Link away from Zelda. :D But with the TOW Zelda would get over the heartbreak and she and Link can still be great friends. :link: :zelda:

I generally agree with your comment on TP Link. But there is nothing for me to believe that he has the personality to woo the more reserved and formal TP Zelda. Not to mention that Zelda does not seem interested in Link in a romantic way at all. How can quietly shy and gentle Link get self confidence from that??

Well, I didn't have any time to read all that, but I caugh the confidence thing in TP. When Link and Zelda look a eachother, then look away, Zelda started it! Only when she looked down did Link do the same. So he didn't feel like that quiet guy he is. It was Zelda who had the lack of confidence to even look at him (I'm not bashing Zelda, because I love her, but it's true, IMO)!

So, there are a fair amount possibilities as to what they felt and how it happened that way:

**1: Zelda gets nervous, looks down to hide the blushing and such, and feeling slighlty guilty for embarrassing the princess, Link does the same.**

**2: Zelda (Z from now on) wants the staring moment to last forever, but there was a Helpless Hyrule to save, so she looks down to regain her focus. Realizing this, Link looks down too.**

**3: Link gets surprised that Z looks down. Seeing that she doesn't look up, he feels like there is no romantic life ahead of them, and averts his gaze toward the ground, slightly heartbroken :( This could lead toward the idea that he goes home to Ordon Village (He did, right?) But, he doesn't know how she feels about such a romantic life between them^^. It's either that she feels the same way, thinking that HE doesn't like her, or she got nervous because she DOES see a romance to come.**
(After all, she has forsight. Which reminds me, why can't they show a scene where Zelda has a dream about Link and her together, to FINALLY clear te dense fog around the situation?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?)

*4: Z knew that Link has an affair at home with another girl, :gags:, so she looks down as to not embarass the hero. Link, who also has home affairs in mind, looks down, slightly disappointed and guilty for leaving home for soo long, and ignores the beauty in front of him (blinded by a horseloving brat with an interesting, short hair cut... typical^^).*

**5: Z wanted to tell him she likes him, but she was more caring about his feelings than her own. Putting him first, she looks away, upset but certain that he loves another (may that not be true! That could either be Illia or Midna).**

6: Zelda hates his heroic guts, and looks away in disgust. <_< ... I don't think that happened.

Is there anything else??? The ones I think that are the most likely have a star. Not always what I hoe for, or what I like, but what is most likely going to happen. The more stars the more likely.

What I interpreted from that scene was more like both of them going "OK...What next?" But honestly I was a little disappointed with the minimal interaction between Link and Zelda in TP. Even the OOT nostalgia scene was just Zelda giving a polite gesture to Link in asking for his help in order to defeat Ganon. Even with them holding hands, I didn't sense anything romantic from that scene either. I like to think that Zelda at least developed an admiration for Links bravery and courage but nothing more than that I'm afraid. Link simply is not assertive enough for me to believe that he can woo Zelda to like him in a romantic way at all.

Because he's the only who has been with each race in Hyrule and seen things from their viewpoint. He has protected them, he has given back their ways of life (i.e. the Gorons with their food in Dodnogo Cavern), and renews them with Zelda/Sheik when Ganondorf mows them down. Zelda would be a fool not to have Link close to her all the time at the very least as her chief adviser. The chemistry that you see in the now-canon manga is icing on the cake.

Malon is just interested in her way of life, as is Ingo and Talon. They just want peace and an economy to make a living. There is nothing wrong with making a living, but there is something wrong with being stuck in a rut. We see Malon's entanglement with her own life when we first see her in the market - everyone else is doing something, she is singing and when she sees Link, asks him go wake her father for her. I have a strong feeling that since she is the daughter of the man who gives the entire castle staff it's supply of milk that she should be able to go in and wake her father just as easily as Link can.

I disagree in that Zelda would just help her immediate area. If she were to do so, then there would be a tremendous revolution from the other races in Hyrule. And while she was able to see and help with much as Sheik, Link is the only one who has as much knowledge on how to help each individual race. What would help one race would hurt another as far as rebuilding goes, and Link would know this very well. In fact, Link's knowledge could possibly save his wife a bit of money for other projects as well.

Where did I say that and where do you get that impression? The true Zelinkers understand that Malon is NOT a bimbo, but she is self-interested. I personally believe that she is an average girl like any other, that she is NOT a slut, that she is NOT a monster, but that she is just the wrong mate for Link. Just because a person is wrong for someone else doesn't make them an evil whore. A mature Zelinker should be able to bring this concept across fairly well.

My statement in this regard was not intended to be taken literally...but then again, maybe I should mean it literally. Should the game explicitly identify Link as a soldier for this to be the actual case? No. Does Link fight tooth and nail for Hyrule and all that it stands for. Yes. Part of the Zelda series' appeal is the subtle undertones of various aspects, and this is one of them.

He would not be a "pathetic useless existence" as you state. He would be King - how is that useless? In reply to an earlier statement you have made, Link as King would NOT take all Zelda's duties away from her. I understand that England's monarchy did that as part of their system, but that doesn't mean that it has to apply to Link and Zelda's situation. There are plenty of lesser known monarchies where the king and queen share equal responsibilities in a broad range of departments.

Where are you getting this information? This seems to be a basis for a lot of your arguments.

I've already stated in another post on another thread that he would NOT be a "freakshow" as you've termed it. What I want to know is how you think that Link could not gain maturity even if he had the mind of a child when he was physically an adult. If we look at the now-canon OoT manga, we see Link making exceptionally difficult decisions early on after his awakening (i.e. the episode with Volvagia, the decision not to become bitter)

I have read a theory that states that Malon and Link had a love child (thus some of the descendants in Ordon in TP) and Link later went on to marry Zelda after he grew up some (thus TP Zelda - look at the facial similarities and even the way her hair is styled). But why is Link's "virginity" treasured? I thought it was a woman's virginity that was treasured.

But since she is so involved with her way of life as I've established, why would she want to do that? Why wouldn't she want to have the pre-packaged knight in shining white armor, as one of the Gossip Stones next to the Temple of Time stated. And I've always been told that when you marry a man as he is, not for what you can change him to be, and this is because when you marry a man, he believes that he was good enough for you like he is. For Malon to marry Link then try to change him is the recipe for divorce, as seen in our Western society today.

Again, we can blame the writers at Nintendo for this. And why would Zelda be even thinking about romance when her entire kingdom is submerged in dark, depressing twilight? And how can she think about romance when she's dead (and yes, I do believe she died at the halfway point)?

This a projection on the part of the player. When Shigeru Miyamoto released the first Zelda, he said that Link would be the "link" between the player and Hyrule. While this role has gradually evolved with each Zelda installment, Link is STILL the "link" between us and a giant fantasy world. When we play a game like this, we naturally bring our biases and experiences with us - it's human nature.

And I would like to say again that if Link derives his self-confidence from other people, then he is not a man and will never be. This goes for ALL people, male or female. A person that must have self-confidence and approval from anyone and everyone is worthless as a human being - and yes, I just used "worthless" and "human being" in the same sentece (I've never been one to stomach political correctness). If any of the Links were to beg for self-confidence from any person, that Link would be worthy to marry no one until he learned to make his OWN self-confidence.

It's not mandatory, it's just she's the centre of the decision-making process. That's likely where he'd be of best use with his knowledge. Yes Zelda has soldiers, etc. But none of them them know Hyrule like Link does.

Malon's more worried about her farm than how the rest of Hyrule is faring. Living with her makes no sense for him whatsoever. Especially since you are incorrect: the centre of Hyrule suffered the worst, not the outlying ( and unimportant ) areas. Look at adult OoT. The Castle is gone, and the marketplace appears burned. Everyone's fled and gone.

Because of the way she is portrayed: very self-involved. She never demonstrates a real interest in either the rest of Hyrule outside the walls of the ranch, or even a personal interest in Link himself. To have her suddenly deeply in love with Link as himself ( like Zelda or Saria ) and wishing to help all Hyrule over herself is taking her out-of-character.

The Adult timeline is irrelevant. Zelda sent back, so this could never happen.

Can we leave the sexual innuendo out? It's irrelevant first off as I'm sure Link is too good a guy to make a life decision of those grounds. As well as the fact Link got sent back in time.

He's not a cherub or any type of innocent child. He's a warrior who's seen much blood. The Link you seem to be talking about is a theoretical one who never left the forest...that's the only way I can ever see Link choosing Malon over Zelda.

Anyways, back to Link's competition. I really think Link would win in the end: his courage would win him the girl. I don't think his social standing would be a problem. Any other men I can see Zelda being interested in are mostly like Link, she might as well have him.

Motion seconded. I've noticed that the innuendo in the argument has been decidedly one-sided - meaning that the male Malinkers are the ones who bring it up. The male Malinkers factor sex into it and without realizing it bring in the "bimbo stereotype" that the Zelinkers allegedly bring in and all the Malinkers rebel against. Surprisingly enough, sex is not the most important thing to get in life, even though our Western culture indoctrinates us with it from the time that we are very small children. This doctrine can bring severe consequences.

O.o Okay... For one, isn't this supposed to focus in on what is ZELDA'S preferences are for a guy?

Anyway... Where shall I start? Okay. Here's for starters. Women should not cater to men whatsoever. That's not to say that she can't do anything for him, but the guy can't EXPECT her to do stuff. It's a two-way thing; they both do things for one another, not because they have to, but because they want to. Few! Glad I got that off my chest.

Continuing... Link and Zelda are the perfect match because of the level of their maturity and their level of understanding for one another. Due to their past experiances with one another, there's no questioning about whether or not they are close. I believe that Zelda is the closest to Link as Link is to Zelda. For Malon... Well, I think that she'd pretty much go with any guy in shining armour that would come along and sweep her off her feet. Zelda, on the other hand, is strong and independant -- fully capable of looking after herself. Thus, as a result, the relationship would be more fulfilling between Link and Zelda, being that they could soley focus on the other as being a close companion. :zelink:

Because he's the only who has been with each race in Hyrule and seen things from their viewpoint. He has protected them, he has given back their ways of life (i.e. the Gorons with their food in Dodnogo Cavern), and renews them with Zelda/Sheik when Ganondorf mows them down. Zelda would be a fool not to have Link close to her all the time at the very least as her chief adviser. The chemistry that you see in the now-canon manga is icing on the cake.

Still you have not given me a good enough reason that he has to be romatically involved with Zelda. Its just the rebuilding of Hyrule. That has nothing to do with dictating who Link should be with romantically. I suggest you stick to in game evidence and leave the irrelevant and stupidly biased comic books out of it. Canon or no Canon

Malon is just interested in her way of life, as is Ingo and Talon. They just want peace and an economy to make a living. There is nothing wrong with making a living, but there is something wrong with being stuck in a rut. We see Malon's entanglement with her own life when we first see her in the market - everyone else is doing something, she is singing and when she sees Link, asks him go wake her father for her. I have a strong feeling that since she is the daughter of the man who gives the entire castle staff it's supply of milk that she should be able to go in and wake her father just as easily as Link can.

Again where are you getting these ridiculous assumptions that Malon is self centered. Its the equivalent of me saying that Zelda is a raging alchoholic

In fact, Link's knowledge could possibly save his wife a bit of money for other projects as well

Yes I agree..He can save Malon a lot of money in renovating LonLon ranch

but that she is just the wrong mate for Link.

How do you know Malon is the wrong mate for Link?? Tell me where in the game does it suggest this??

He would not be a "pathetic useless existence" as you state. He would be King - how is that useless? In reply to an earlier statement you have made, Link as King would NOT take all Zelda's duties away from her. I understand that England's monarchy did that as part of their system, but that doesn't mean that it has to apply to Link and Zelda's situation. There are plenty of lesser known monarchies where the king and queen share equal responsibilities in a broad range of departments

So Zelda will just simply make him King overnight?? Please elaborate

Where are you getting this information? This seems to be a basis for a lot of your arguments.

IN GAME EVIDENCE. Have you even played OOT??

I've already stated in another post on another thread that he would NOT be a "freakshow" as you've termed it. What I want to know is how you think that Link could not gain maturity even if he had the mind of a child when he was physically an adult. If we look at the now-canon OoT manga, we see Link making exceptionally difficult decisions early on after his awakening (i.e. the episode with Volvagia, the decision not to become bitter)

Because it makes no logical sense that he can just gain mental maturity out of the blue with no explanation. Again..stick to game evidence. Leave the biased comic books out of it.

But why is Link's "virginity" treasured? I thought it was a woman's virginity that was treasured.

So are you actually saying that Links virginity is not treasured??

But since she is so involved with her way of life as I've established, why would she want to do that? Why wouldn't she want to have the pre-packaged knight in shining white armor, as one of the Gossip Stones next to the Temple of Time stated. And I've always been told that when you marry a man as he is, not for what you can change him to be, and this is because when you marry a man, he believes that he was good enough for you like he is. For Malon to marry Link then try to change him is the recipe for divorce, as seen in our Western society today.

Again...where are you getting these ridiculous assumptions about Malon divorcing Link. I could just turn that around and say Zelda forcing him to be King is a recipe for divorce.

^ I'm going to go respond to this in the Malon thread.

I apologize for getting off topic somehow.

Back on topic: If Link can develop a little more assertiveness and better public speaking skills in OOT(Child Timeline) and TP, he should be enabled to woo Zelda from any random nobleman/knight.

OOT(Adult Timeline) Him being a special needs child with a bizarre fairy hovering above him should motivate some Hyrule Knights to beat the living crap out of him and kick him out of the Castle. Therefore Zelda will just have to settle for marrying a Hyrule nobleman :D

Yes and no. I'm not saying that Link's virginity isn't treasured, I'm saying that any man's "virginity" isn't treasured. Virginity is something that has been historically associated with women and not with men. Historically speaking, a man's virginity was something to be gotten rid of as early as possible, and a woman's was something that was given to the very highest bidder, to the man who was considered honorable enough to warrant her virginity.

So no, from a historical viewpoint a man's virginity is really worth next to nothing. However, if we come at this from certain spiritual principles - say, Judeo-Christian principles - then the man's virginity is worth the same as the woman's. Take that as you will.

This is a stance that bleeds Oedipal complexity. Tell me, if a regular Hylian Knight can "beat the crap" out of him, as you've said, how could he have aspired to try to tangle with a Gerudo guard, the bosses of each temple, and most of all Ganondorf? Drawing from your conclusions, you are saying that your projection on Link is that of bumbling, mentally incapacitated, useless-to-society character that was just randomly parked in the games - true or no?

>.< Regarding MalonLover's comment... Firstly, you don't even have to visit the ranch in OoT to beat the game. You only need your old friend, the hookshot, to get yourself across the bridge in the valley. Secondly... Why on earth are we talking about virginity? I don't recall nintendo implying to anyone that Link was having intimate relations. >.> *cough* E rated game *cough* However, I do think it should be equal between men and women; why should women be viewed any differently from men when it comes to this topic? Everything should be equal all across the board.

Now...back on topic. For Zelda, I think she would marry someone that has a similar personality to hers, someone that she felt she could relate to. She would have to have someone that would understand that she is very independant so that he wouldn't deprive that of her. Link falls into this very category, so he would be a grand choice.

[QUOTE=Love_of_Zelda,Sep 2 2008, 02:56 AM] [QUOTE]Drawing from your conclusions, you are saying that your projection on Link is that of bumbling, mentally incapacitated, useless-to-society character that was just randomly parked in the games - true or no? [/QUOTE]

YES LOVE OF ZELDA ITS TRUE :P Seriously though lighten up a little. Its obvious I'm kidding. IMO there is just nothing there for me to believe that Zelda would just relinquish her royal title to a man/child, who by your own admission, has never spoken. Its an insult to Zeldas character that she would allow this to happen, mainly because it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

BACK ON TOPIC:Zelda should choose a man that DOES NOT have an annoying fairy hovering and twirling around him, and can actually verbally communicate words besides just grunting and sighing.

No, it's not obvious that you are kidding, IMO.

And for goodness sake: Link CAN talk! He just doesn't visibly because we are supposed to be his voice. He talks in MM very clearly to the Deku Princess. And you can see his mouth moving as he's apparently having a conversation with Ilia as he's going to meet Bo in TP.

I can accept he may be quiet, but not incapable of speaking. In terms of competition, Zelda would likely come across many men with words to say. Flattering, arrogant and shallow men would likely be instantly turned down as she's way too smart to fall for that. Link may be a man of few words, but he's a man of depth, honor and courage. She would likely love that about him: she's talkative enough for the two of them anyways! ( and this happens much in real life, to the satisfaction of both quiet man and noisy woman )

The fact of the matter is that Zelda sent Link back to the Child Timeline, thus she more likely ended up marrying a Hyrule nobleman anyway. And IMO, even if Link did stay the result would have been the same for her, and Link would have settled down with the alternate love interest of choice (More likely Malon) during a time of peace and stability in Hyrule. So it makes sense that Link went back to the Child Timeline or else Zelda would have ordered him to stay if she thought she had a chance to be with him romantically.

In TP, maybe but IMO, there isn't much depth to Link except that he is really good in taking orders and being very obedient. His working relationship with Midna is solid proof of this.

Actually, Zelda would not purposefully allow for Link to remain in the alternate timeline as an adult, simply because she feels that she robbed Link of the time that he lost as a child. This portrays that she is a selfless individual who will do whatever it takes to enstill happiness in others, no matter the cost. Link is very much the same. Also, Link, even though Zelda sends him back in time, returns to the castle to see Zelda, and it's not because he HAD to. It's because he wanted to. Another thing that can be argued is the fact that Zelda is the only one that he remembers in MM, being that she is the one that he is the closest to, the one that he connects with spiritually and emotionally. I suppose you could say that they are "soul mates". And finally, in TP, there are some hidden hints that leave a trail leading to the pairing of Link and Zelda. Upon meeting, Zelda catches Link's attention immediately as he most likely is able to sense her personality in his wolf form. That's only one, but I am able to list more scenes if requested.

I agree with Zelda being selfless in sending Link back to the Child Timeline to allow him to mature normally as he was supposed to. But the scene in MM where Link appears with Epona side by side before his departure from Zelda is good indication that he may have a relevant and meaningful friendship with Malon instead of an exclusive one with Zelda only. And since the ending of OOT indicated that the Door of Time was still open, its more plausible that he still remembers his social contact with Malon and even Ruto, and not just exclusively Zelda. But it makes perfect sense that he went back to see Zelda first since it was the last person he saw in the Adult Timeline. But its still not concrete proof that he is destined to be with Zelda always and forever as the MM cutscene of Link leaving Zelda on his own freewill clearly indicated. Perhaps a prophetic hint of another destiny with someone else in the future?? Hmm..makes you think huh??

That "Link left so his relationship with Zelda is questionable" argument seems a bit weak to me. For a gameplay purpose, it's likely as simple as the makers desired to send him on another adventure, but Hyrule's peace would mean another land.
From a romantic standpoint, a relationship that cannot handle some distance and time apart is obviously a weak one to begin with. But Zelda obviously knew that Link needed to go because it was important to him and he was released with faith, and went knowing she believed in him. I really don't think that the trip indicated an end to their relationship or would result in that.

However, as much as Link may now come across temptation in being away from her, the same would happen to Zelda. How easy would it be for her to slip into an Anju-ish, "Did he run off with someone else?" especially if she is alone and some suitors come calling. If Zelda was any less strong and faithful, Link may return to find her with another. Especially if the pressure of being a single female heir came into play. But I believe he would return and she'd still be waiting for him. But there would be no shortage of quality men waiting in the wings for her.

If Link theoretically did leave Zelda again to be with Malon in the future, I believe that they can still maintain their relationship in being great friends and continue to work together in maintaining peace and prosperity throughout the kingdom of Hyrule. With that said, I actually think your opinion is reasonable, but since the Child Timeline ends after MM we can't know for sure who Link ends up with.

Actually, if you think about it, we have an idea of what Link decides to do; being that Zelda is able to foretell things about the future in her prophecies, we have a pretty good idea that Link returns to Hyrule in order to see Zelda. Either that or he was somehow killed tragically and they meet up again in Wind Waker (reincarnations occur after tragic events, and supposedly Link and Zelda are reincarnated in Wind Waker). And the only reason he left Hyrule was because he was searching for Navi. At the end of MM, however, I believe he makes the attempt to return home, to Hyrule. Another thing is that after experiancing certain things from his adventure, he most likely wouldn't be able to "settle down" and live on the ranch with Malon, simply because he would always try to look at Hyrule as a whole in order to protect its peace and harmony. Therefore maintaining a relationship with Zelda while being the highest rank of knights would probably be Link's best bet.

Maybe, but since MM concludes the timeline there is no real closure on this subject of debate on who Link ends up with. There are even theorists that believe that he remained in Termina to hook up with Romani, which is obviously more LinkxMalon than LinkxZelda. But I guess we are just stuck on theorizing and debating about this with no real closure ever happening anytime soon. All I know is that MM cutscene of Link leaving with Epona as Zelda sadly watches him go is one of my fave cutscenes. :D

There's no clear closure. It think it's fairly obvious he returned to Hyrule for two reasons: a ) the people speak of him as the legendary hero by the time TP comes around suggesting he did deeds again. Where else would the adult sized bow come from? B) the Hero's Spirit is likely to actually be him.

True...I too concurr that I believe that the Hero Spirit is OOT Link as well. But based on this theory, its still vague on who OOT Link ends up with. When the Hero Spirit references a bloodline, he never remotely indicates that its a ROYAL bloodline. Even though I would like to think that reason alone is enough for a LinkxMalon, but the overall vagueness of the Hero Spirit can't really confirm this for me. So I guess its safe to say that Link DID return to Hyrule after the MM adventure, but the issue of who Zelda ultimately marries between Link or a random Hyrule nobleman is still up in the air. :(

Agreed. It IS vague. Malinkers use Ordon and Epona to make their case, Zelinkers use the Magic Armor.

Just to point out: he wouldn't call himself a King, even if it were true. a) outside of the game perspective: the makers would never nail down his fate like that. It would just upset fans. and B ) We need to remember that his function was to pass on the heroic mantle, regardless of who he is. All that matters is that him and Link are kindred spirits, even if one was a King and the other a village boy who herds goats.
Otherwise from that, all that seems certain is that the HS is a great warrior who watches Hyrule even after his death. His devotion I would suggest makes him more likely to have been heavily involved with the running of the kingdom in his lifetime however.

And it always will be. We can concretely say she married some other man after Adult OoT because Tetra is of her bloodline. TP Zelda on the other hand may or may not even be related to the grown up Zelda of MM. She likely is though as royalty is hereditary. She also does bear some resemblance to Link, but Link and Zelda have often somewhat similar features...it's uncertain whether it's intentional or accidental. I do think that when Link returned to Hyrule after MM that there's a strong possibility that he would marry Zelda though: a) because of his apparent feelings for her and B ) the more he wants to be involved with Hyrule, the more often he would be in close proximity to her. ( Facilitating them bonding. )
The more Zelda was with Link, the less time she would also be spending with another man.

lol It's obvious that there is something there between Link and Zelda. They even distinctly show Link wallowing in sadness when thinking back to his times with Zelda. Also, Zelda had told Link that the "Song of Time" reminded her of "them", of the days that they "spent together in Hyrule", as quoted by Zelda in MM. It also states that the Ocarina is one of Link's most valuable possessions because of the meaning behind it and the person that it connects him to, one who is none other than Zelda herself.

As far as Link and Zelda being related in TP... Well, I highly doubt it. TP isn't actually the continuation of another game, as stated by one of the developers in an interview (which was in one of the GamePro magazines when it first hit the screens). It pretty much just starts fresh, probably just allowing other people who didn't play the previous games to start in and go along with the story. It's the same with OoT; it didn't follow the previous games and instead started over in a different tale, or really, a different version of the tale.

With the MM cutscene, Zelda definitely has genuine affection for Link undoubtedly. As for Link, there was nothing there that indicated any emotional feelings from him at all. He just learned the song of time and just left with Epona, totally indifferent to the situation. Link didn't even give Zelda a goodbye hug. And of course he was feeling sad and down trodden during that memory sequence. HE WAS A DEKU SCRUB for crying out loud. And of course his memory went back to Zelda because she was the one that taught him the SONG OF TIME. I'm not saying Link doesn't care for Zelda, but I'm definitely not saying he hates Malon either. Its just literal in game evidence gives no indication that Link has any special feelings for Zelda or Malon other than just maybe a platonic friendship with both of them and nothing more.

As for TP, I agree that Link and Zelda are not related for the same reasons that you have stated Twilight Mistress.

Even though Link was in his deku scrub form, his mannerisms while remembering Zelda gave away his feelings and the fact that Link does view Zelda as more than just a friend. He's staring into space for such a long period of time after relearning the song, that Tattl has to bring him back to reality. It's also the style in which it was written, displaying some sadness on Link's part: "memories of Zelda come rushing back to you..." Funny that in the darkest hour, it was Zelda that he remembered.

And just because Link didn't give her a "hug" doesn't mean anything. Generally Link wouldn't go up and "hug" anyone because he's too shy. It also states when he recieves the ocarina that it is a special possession that he treasures from Zelda. Even when you hit on the info button it describes the fact that it is a special item that reminds "you" of Zelda. Had Link have forumulated a strong bond with Malon other than friendship, he would not have needed to be reminded of Epona's song by Romani. If Malon was anything more special than the cucoo lady, I'm sure that there would have been a memory included for Malon as well (and since he didn't remember Epona's song, he likely forgot about Malon. We tend to only remember things on our own that are most important to us). Another thing is that Zelda spent time with Link in Hyrule before he left; I don't recall him spending that much time with anyone else.

x 2. I thought it was completely obvious he was angsting over being away from Zelda, or at least leaving her. You can say that the Song of Time was merely functional, but they didn't have to attach the sentiment to it that they did. It was a conscious choice on the maker's part to convey feelings in a critical plot point. Link was on the verge of death yet Zelda was able to distract him. You just can't equate Malon to having kind of power over Link.

As for the Deku Scrub thing: I think we need to look deeper here. Remember how Tatl comments about the Deku Scrub in the tunnel looking like it wanted to cry? That was obviously the Scrub that died to give Link his mask. The Deku Butler pretty much confirms it later as he comments on Link reminding him of his son. Anyways, Link is suddenly turned into a sad-looking Deku Scrub, don't you think it's particularily appropriate considering his mood at the outset of the game? Him looking so "sad" as a Deku Scrub after being reminded of Zelda may be entirely on purpose.

I'm afraid I have to challenge your claim that TP is unconnected though, TM. There's another interview that states that TP takes place 100/s of year/s after the child ending of OoT. So while TP is a different Link, different people, etc, it's set far in the future after MM. I was referring to TP Zelda looking like OoT Link actually, not TP Link. In regards to her having a relation to TP Link ( who could be related to OoT Link ) I'm not worried. Hundreds of years is quite a bit of time for blood and space to genetically seperate the two.

Actually that's another argument that many use to try to direct Zelda towards another man: "Oh no! She's related to Link!!". For the reason above, it's not a problem even if both are descended directly from a Hero and Princess who married.
If Zelda did marry someone else, I think would be because Link is not available ( after Adult OoT ) or because they didn't connect. ( TP, IMO )

I guess everyone has there own different interpretations on what Link was feeling, but I have to agree to disagree on that one for the reasons I stated previously. For one thing he is only 9 years old. And it also doesn't make sense that he is getting warm and fuzzy feelings for Zelda when its more obvious that he is more concerned about getting out of his Deku Scrub predicament. As for him not remembering Malon when it came to Epona's song has more to do with Malon being a secondary character than him resenting her for no apparant reason. So of course Zelda is going to get the cutscene parts since she is the main heroine of the Zelda series named after her. But at the same time, it doesn't mean that he resents Malon in anyway. I know you Zelinkers hate and totally detest the whole Link-Epona-Malon connection, but the fact that Link uses Epona in MM is more than a good enough indication that he maintained friendly social contact with Malon after the OOT adventure. Another thing for you Zelinkers. Two words: CREMIA HUG. :D I know you Zelinkers loved seeing that huh?? :P

BTW..is it true that there are Zelinkers out there that have completed OOT and MM without using Epona because they really hate Malon that much?? Do they really see Malon as that big of a threat to a LinkxZelda romantic relationship??

As for TP, it seems there are two camps. LinkxZelda had multiple children for Link and Zelda in TP and LinkxMalon for Link in TP while Zelda married a Hyrule noble for TP Zelda. I'm for the latter of course but I admit the former is also a plausible theory.

Huh. That's incredibly petty of you. There's no need to get that way, we can all be polite here. If you can't be than very simple. I won't debate with you.

Anyways, resenting someone and just being apathetic are two different things. Resenting someone means you actively dislike them: where have we ever suggested that about Malon? Of course he's friends with her. I personally believe that as far as it goes however. The Cremia hug is no different than the Great Fairy hitting on him in WW and apparently in TP...he's getting attention from womenfolk and likes it.

OOPS :o sorry. I meant to imply that SOME Zelinkers feel that Link resents Malon. At least you admitted that Link and Malon are possibly friends. :thumbs:

But yeah..I agree the Cremia hug doesn't guarantee anything for a LinkxMalon. But the fact that its there and that it probably made SOME Zelinkers quite upset was good enough for me. :)

BTW..did you finally complete the Cave of Ordeals to unlock the cutscene fo Links interaction with the great fairy that I had mentioned to you in the ZU forum?? But yeah, Link seemed to REALLY like being touched by the fairy for sure.