While searching the web i have picked up some rumours about the Eldar creating the ethereals, as to make sure the safety of the galaxy is ensured if they would ever vanish from it. These rumours are based on Xenology, a book with a lot of info on Tau Kroot, Orks, Eldar and some new races, including the Q'orl. It seems that the Q'orl have a similar organ that also defends them from chaos. It also appears that the eldar have abducted one of the Q'rol and the connection between those two is easily made i guess. So what are you opinions on this matter?


Shas

I think I mentioned my theory on this a loooong time ago.

I believe that the Ethereals were made by a (or some) surviving Old Ones to combat the 'crons. They were known to be able to control warp storms. This could explain the phenomena that kept the imperials from eradicating and colonizing t'au. Then during the strife they created the ethereals to band the Tau together. Helping them achieve a state of technological advancement that could fight off the 'crons and protect themselves from the other races. Being unable to register in the warp, the tau could not be corrupted or destroyed outright by chaos like the eldar were, and yet organized enough to launch sensible campaign, unlike the orks. Both were created by the old ones to fight the 'crons. Then again for all we know the ethereals "are" the old ones.

Another supporting attribute to this theory is the warp storms around the Tau sector "turned off" as the 'crons were rising from their graves. Lead by the ethereals.
And instead of destroying all others (like the 'crons) they seek to assimilate and work for the greater good.

Another old one theory I have is that the ancient weapon the farsight uses is necron/old one technology, that influences him. If its necron- than this is whats driving him to kill the orks, the 'cron enemy the old ones made to combat the 'crons. This would also support why he broke away from the Tau if the ethereals are in co-hoots with the old ones. If its old one tech, Destroying the orks for failing/ causing chaos and not fighting the 'crons. OR paving his way through orks to get to some sort of large 'cron citadel.

I've heard the Eldar theory before and it's not completely unreasonable. I don't mind the idea that some outside agent is manipulating us for their own ends, either Eldar or Old Ones, as long as we aren't being mind controlled by that lame pheremone theory.

Even if the Eldar did it (Which Is the line I go with currently) the Old ones might still be behind it :>. I think however that Ethereals are not old ones as Tau Technology would be greater otherwise.

For 2k years going from sticks and stones to better weapons and technology than the empire, other than warp travel, I think the technology has come far even with old one technology. Tau still needed to learn concepts to know how to use technology. Perhaps they haven't hit the time to learn the concept of the old ones weapons . The tau is still going fast on technology, though spreading the empire may have slowed it a bit.

And I agree with nevermore, that pheromone thing is stupid. I could understand if we were bugs, but were not. For the Mal'kor maybe but the tau?

It's about 6000 years, not 2000.

It's always confused me a bit that 6000 years is supposed to be fast for technological development. We don't know how long before that first contact the Tau had been at the stone knives and bearskins stage, but we in the real world have gone from nomadic hunter gatherers to modern day in about 5500 years, that gives us humans another 500 years to match Tau technology before they have gotten there faster than us.

Take into account another 500 years or so of dark ages that the Tau avoided because of the Ethereals and we have a full 1000 years still.

Now consider that any Tau technology that real world science considers possible we can reasonably expect to master in the next hundred years or so and Tau technological progress starts to seem slow.

(BTW, this is one of the reasons why I thought a chronology in the Tau lexicon would be a good idea)

thats all true, but the imperium still uses steam powered space ships after 40,000 years, so the tau have advanced quickly.

i doubt the old ones are the etherials, GW can never make up their mind what the old ones are now... sometimes they say dead, sometimes floating around the warp, they even hinted that they were snotlings.... i think the assumption is that whatever they are its very mysterious and shrouded.... go figure

the pheromone thing isn't "mind control" it just inspires fire warriors to fight on more for the greater good. it wouldn't work if they already didn't believe in the greater good

as for farsights scythe/axe/thing, I have never liked the theory that its some kind of daemon weapon that is controlling him. and i believe he only killed all those orks because either t'au or his enclave were being invaded. the old ones may have been smart, but i guess they are fallible enough to not program their creations to fight amongst themselves.

The other option of course is that the tau were created by the star gods to destroy chaos. being immune to the warp and daemonic possession would make them the ultimate force for combating chaos

The biggest problem i have with saying that the ethereals were created is that it's all way to dificult. Why bother with bio-engineering them and placing them back amongst the other tau and then let them evolve some more. Why not create an uber-race, brainwash them as to believe they evolved and let them get on with it?

Sometimes i have the feeling people are completely paranoid and want to believe all things are created. While it is perfectly possible that when the first humans met the Tau, before the warp storms, the ethereals were already on the planet, but somewhere on a remote location (keep in mind that planets are BIG) and evolved there.

The confusion about the 2000 or 6000 years times is logical. The Tau have been known to man for 6000 years. The first contact happend in 789.M35 (this can be translated as the year 34.789 right?). Then, according to the codex, at the end of the 37th millenium the ethereals appear. (so that must be around the year 36.800) This is where you have a lap of 2000 years. But after these 2000 years the codex says the Tau expand dynamically for a thousand years. After this there will be another 3000 thousand years of expansion and probably the second imperial contact happend in the beginning of it somewhere. The codex ends with saying that the battle of Ichar IV troubles the imperium of man and the Tau and that the Tau prepare for war. This happens around the year 40.000, but now we are already in the 41st centure (some say around the year 40.999) so that means that there have been a thousand years more between these points. More research should be done on this i guess.


Shas

As far as my old one theory, I like to entertain that the ethereals were another tribe that has always been an "enlightened" trait as their trait for their tribe. The old ones took their leaders and put them in the right location at the right time to solve the problem. "As the 37th millennium drew to a close, many strange portents and omens were observed such as flickering lights in the hight sky and half-glimpsed figures in the mountains." - Tau book pg. 5. This could be the Old ones "summoning" the Ethereals to the region. Perhaps they followed the stars that lead them to the strife. Its a bit mystical I know however its how the legend goes and is the only thing we have to go by were the ethereals came from.

Again no one knows and its an idea I've entertained since I first read the story.

Thier creations didn't fight while the Old ones where there... and things have evolved etc since then for example orks used to be smart but when the old ones went they deevolved which is why orks can sometimes do really advanced technology that the Imperials don't understand and maybe races such as the Tau and Elder might not understand. They don't make technology by luck but because the old ones gave them genetic memory as how to build the technology.

Basically no ones knows anything substantial about the old ones. There is even a theory that the old ones where once human. The old ones as far as anyone knows could be pulling the strings behind the galaxy. Some people think that the Tyranids may even have been made by the old ones.

perhaps, the old one realised their failure in creating the orks, so decided that perhaps the second time around they tried a less ambitious plan, finding a race with good prospects, and nudge them in the right direction

that is part of the story, alot of ork technology only works because orks are the most powerful psykers in the 'ooniverse, they just don't realise it. however whatever the orks "know" effectively works, which is why da red ones go fastah and the ork gods exist. they probably had control of their psychic powers originally, but over thousands of years they evolved to be the way they are

and before anyone asks why daemons don't posses them, cuz gork (or possibly mork) wud bash em in da ead! if they tried

Correction, it has been more like 1000 years of dark ages.

No, I really don't think so.

The so called "dark ages", a term most of my fellow archaeologists hate, really only lasted from about 500 AD to 1000 AD. After that, European history gives way the the later middle ages in which culture, technology, and the like had recovered enough from the fall of Rome to start innovating and establishing connections across the continent again.

And in case anyone is concerned that my take on this is too Euro-centric, from what I understand most of the other regions of the world suffered similar social collapses at some point or another.

Thats what I was referring to. Europe has not always had the most advanced civilizations on the planet. Many times the Middle East and China were much more advanced. You cannot compare people living in huts and sleeping in furs to people that could read, write and use algebra to solve problems.

And my point was that the other great cultures of the world have had similar periods of social collapse, just not at the same time. It's just that the So called dark age of Europe is most familiar to most of the board members and is the one I have easiest access to dates.

It is also the one that most applies to human technological development as it has been mostly western society that has driven the industrial and information ages, although China and India are rapidly catching up there.

The 500 years of European stagnation after the fall of Rome seems (to me) the most applicable for comparing what the Tau avoided by the coming of the Ethereals and making any judgments about the speed of technological advancement.