Here's another controversial question:

Who can decide who has Discernment of the demonic, and who doesn't?

It seems to me that Discernment is a special gift from God. It has been defined as such on many forum boards.

There does seem to be the opinion that anyone outside of the Christian faith couldn't possibly have Discernment. I understand the reasoning. If one is a Christian, that is truly *the only* faith. Got it.

What I don't understand is if the demon predates religion, how come only one religion gets the inside scoop on the demon? It seems to me that God sees the soul, and not the vessel. Only *He* would determine who He gifts. The judgement of man would seem to have little to no impact on that decision. Psychics and mediums are obviously deceived if they're not Christian? I'm not buying it. I guess the Shaamans were way out in left field, as were the Greeks, as were any other cultural religion that existed before Christianity itself? Right?

Wrong.

And, how does your physical shape have anything to do with it? I read someone that actually said if you're obese, smoke, or swear that you couldn't possibly be holy enough to have Discernment. So is Discernment a Gift, or do you have to earn it?


Someone clear this up for me.

Good Lord, woman...you want to make me work this morning.

First off, I wish you would start giving me the sources that are feeding you this crap. Sounds like decay in prime form, and I feel obligated to give them a sound drumming.

Beside the point.

God can, has, and will give out His gifts in the manner He sees fit. Has precious little to do with your percieved holiness. Damn, I'm living proof of that. How many times have you known me to be wrong?

Remember Ralph Sarchee? People wonder how he could work in this line and his response was 'how amazing (or wonderful...i forget) that He could use a sinner like me'?

If God gives you a gift, the only questions are: if you accept it and recognise Who its from.

Now do something useful and go back to sleep.

-scl

I had a family friend who was a catholic Priest and an Exorcist.
He worked in some horrible parts of the world,doing missionary work.
he smoked a pipe and cursed like a sailor(never using the Lords name in vain)
and he was one of the Vatican's go to guys for exorcisms in many near eastern countries.
in Matthew 15:11 Jesus telling the crowds "Listen and understand.what goes into a man's mouth does not make him unclean,but what comes out of his mouth,that is what makes him unclean"


so I doubt that smoking or being overweight has anything to do with our spiritual state..but using gods name as a curse word is different matter!

IMO

Sychar

I do say my dear you know how to fire up someone in the morning don't you :poke: .

I have to go by way of agreeing with everyone else. It isn't your religion or even your state of being holy.

God uses the sinner more than he does the holy.

Think about it.

Most of the influencing people come from a more than questionable back ground. I am no *ang* by far I would have been considered *dev* and even tried as a witch or heretic. I also am not afraid to state I am over wieght, smoke and can out drink some men, strange hobby finding ways to fit a certain Taboo word into a sentence as many times as I can. People really don't like this word I think it packs a punch when used so I use it often.

God's name in vain, I try real hard not to, if I slip up I apologize and usualy get a punishment in some form. My mom is gone and if I slip I will still get that stinging sensation like when she was alive and would smack my mouth. :( . So I am not perfect and I don't think anyone is.

All this existed in before the time of record keeping so I don't think being Holy determines this.

God gives his gift to who ever he wants. Just like he sends his *ang* where he wants. These things are a knowledge that is ment for him and him alone. *clap*

I think it might be important to define your terms.

Religion? If that is the relationship between God and man, that might make the first religion to date to the existance of the first man. It would also be important to establish that there may well be false religions, people who believe that they have a relationship with God when they do not

Demons? It took me a while to understand why people were claiming this, but i think there is some merit to the assertion that the demons are the offspring of the fallen angels who mated with women. So religion might well predate the demons in their present forms. People often claim that other religions predate Christianity, but if Christ is God and the creator of everything, then any any human relationship with Him before His incarnation would have been the first true religion.

Discernment? the faculty of discerning; discrimination; acuteness of judgment and understanding. This can be both the natural ability to think that God has given everyone, or a supernatural knowledge that could come from God or from some other spiritual source (satanic or demonic).

Robert -

No one else seemed to have a problem with deciphering what I was saying but you - so perhaps you're having troubles with how I define things.

Obviously, you define it differently.

I agree with Twinkle.

Demons are not the offspring of the daughters of men and angels. Demons are fallen Angels.

Demon: from the Latin Daemon means evil spirit, 1) a source agent of evil, distress, harm or ruin; 2) an attendant power or spirit; 3) A supernatural being of Greek mythology that served as intermediate between gods and men.

Demons predate religion. Man is older than written religion. Man has always had some system of belief it shows in even the signs of civilization when there still was no religion set in place like the big 3 Christianity, Islam, Jewish.

So how do you explain away the beliefs of even our ealiest of ancestors?

One thing I always wondered about when people claim they have discernment. Does discernment mean you can recognize demons ALL the time or can you claim discernment if you recognize demons some times but at other times you can be fooled?

I wonder this because I often can tell demonics from other spirits. Most of the time actually, but I do have occassion where I am not sure. I have one evp just recently gotten in which I cannot tell whether it is demonic or not. My intuition is telling me no it is not, but the things I have seen it do would seem demonic to me.

Now see I have had this problem also.

So how do we know if we have discernment or not. I always stick with my intuition. The gut hasn't let me down.

That's a really good question.

I suppose that someone with Discernment should be able to know 100% of the time, and this is what separates someone with Discernment from a Psychic.

I think SCLandes was right when he was talking about semantics. A psychic who can also discern the demonic is someone with Discernment.

I think many people can discern. It is more if they choose to. I don't know really know how to say what I am thinking other than just out with it.

You can discern when something is not right. It has many names, intution (sp), gut feeling and instinct.

I have walked into places and can feel when there is just a nasty mean spirit between the the ones trying to get your attention. Down to even the difference between a child and a teen when pranks are more the norm in a house.

I have only once in a long time went into a house and could tell what I was going to be coming face to face with was not human. I just could feel it. Everything was different in the home from the air and the moods to the way food tasted.

If the creator of all things bestowed upon one.,, this gift he would give them also the gift of knowledge to understand the discernment at hand

and if he spoke threw the mouth of a donkey to balam in his error

he would chose any

for the scriptures tell us He is a respector of no persons so he choses who is to have and who is not to its not are call

Now if you ask God for wisdom He will give it to you but the key thing is to believe for the gifts come without repentance

hope's this brings some light on the case

Priar Rob

I don't know if this is considered a part of discernment or not, but is anyone else also able to sense not only when a demonic is around, but when a spirit is going to cause physical events? I can feel when they are gathering energy and something is about to occur. Not all the time with ghosts, but I certainly seem to be able to tell when a demonic is going to do something. Not sure why I can always tell with demonics but not ghosts. Maybe because the energy is so much stronger it is easier to sense?


Its funny how strong that feeling can come upon you when a demonic is nearby. The entire energy in the room changes. Deep, thick, dusty air, oppressive feeling. You can actually feel the energy in your skin and head. My head, skin, and breathing changes rapidly, telling me that something is going to happen. My poor family deals with the results of my work some times coming home with me and I can make them paranoid in an instant by telling them the room air just changed. lol.

Actually I am very proud of my niece, she just recently began to discern when a spirit is near and is able to announce when she feels something is going to happen. Sleep overs at my house with my son and niece are getting quite popular with their friends wanting to see action. lol (just kidding. actually I limit sleepovers when there is activity going on).

I think it is the same thing. I just feel different than you do.

Mine is just as intense. I just think that the gifts are the same it is the people that are different. So we are different because we are individuals. Just with the same gifts.

I don't come up against to many demonics. I hunt alone. So I am careful of the cases I take. If I get one that is out of my league then I can help them find a group that can help them.

LD you are truly special in what you do. I teach my son also. He can sometimes get it when there is a spirit in the house. He is really tuned in for ghosts. I hope he doesn't have to deal with a demonic to early.

I learned my lesson the hard way with dealing with demonics baptized by fire. So to speak.

I can tell when there is demonics about most of the time, but it has always been dead on when i am in or on location.

Exactly. I think everyones gifts are adjusted to their personality and energy, so each person will experience things a bit differently. I love hearing how others experience things because there is always plenty to be learned from each other and several times I have changed the way I pick up on things because I liked the way someone else described how they do it. Some things are difficult to change, but it is always good to try and hear how others do it.

I wish I could say I don't come up on many demonics... Maybe I will start another thread on this so I dont distract from the discernment thread.

I will answer this but I feel the need to write a disclaimer first.

I am not, in any sense of the word, a "traditional" Christian. I do not believe MOST of what a traditional Christian would. We share a God, a Saviour, and the Holy Bible but there the similarities end.. I would be happy to explain this further in PM so feel free to ask any questions... :)

I have the gift of Discernment. Without question. I DO believe it was granted to me through the Holy Spirit. I do not believe only Christians could have it though. God said "put no other gods before me." I have never read any passage in the Bible (and I have read the entire Bible a number of times) that said "there are no other gods." What a person believes in comes down to their relationship with their god. Can those gods grant gifts? I have to believe they can, as I have seen the manifestation of gifts in other belief systems.

Ahhh.. it gets so complicated to try and explain in a few short sentences lol.

True he said no other Gods before him. I may believe there are other powers but there is only one creator with many names.

I agree, there are other gods. I lived part of my early life as a pagan and witch, before converting to Christianity, and I have experienced other gods, and their gifts they give as well. During my work I still occassionally come across other gods.

As a Hellenic Reconstructionist - the very cosmology and theology of our belief system makes it impossible for there *not* to be more than one god.

These gods do grant their blessings upon us when we live ethically and correctly.

I have received those blessings firsthand.