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Posted: Sep 2 2009, 01:09 PM
Member No.: 1,066
Joined: 17-August 09
Craig didn't have much time right now as he's off to catch a flight, but his quick response was "BS. Straight BS. Not even their own 2007 released radar data shows such a thing. Just another layer of disinfo to try and add to the confusion."
I myself am a bit busy these days with multiple projects, so I haven't had time to read this in depth, so I'm curious to hear some reaction.
http://911blogger.com/node/21059 (hyperlinks at url)
Two military aircraft were flying at high altitude near the Pentagon around the time it was hit on 9/11, but the identities of these aircraft and what they were doing over the Pentagon are unknown.
The planes had the call signs "Bobcat 14" and "Bobcat 17." A partial transcript of air traffic controller communications reveals they were communicating with the control tower at Washington's Reagan National Airport, which is less than a mile from the Pentagon, between at least 9:31 a.m. and 9:40 a.m. on September 11.  (The attack on the Pentagon took place at 9:37 a.m. ) Radar data has shown that the two aircraft flew "in trail" (in single file, with one directly behind the other) at an altitude of 21,000 feet, and were overhead in the few minutes before the Pentagon was hit. 
LAUNCHED FROM DOVER AIR BASE
It would seem essential to establish the exact identities of these aircraft and find out what they were doing in the vicinity of the Pentagon at such a critical time. Yet, eight years after the attacks took place, we still do not have this information. (The fact that these aircraft were near the Pentagon at the time it was hit is itself virtually unknown.)
According to a 9/11 Commission memorandum, "flight strips and other information" indicate that the two aircraft, Bobcat 14 and Bobcat 17, "originated out of Dover Air Force Base in Delaware." The memorandum added, "It is possible, but not confirmed, that they were Air Force corporate passenger jets." When questioned by the 9/11 Commission, Bob Lazar, the acting operations manager at Reagan Airport on September 11, said he "did not remember any aircraft with the call sign 'Bobcat' that hung out over the National airspace" that day. All he could say was that he did remember two aircraft "coming from the north, but he did not think that they entered National's airspace." 
OTHER AIRCRAFT NEAR THE PENTAGON
Furthermore, there were at least two other military aircraft near the Pentagon at the time it was hit. A C-130 cargo plane that took off from Andrews Air Force Base, which is 10 miles from the Pentagon, was airborne by 9:33 a.m., and was seen by numerous witnesses above the Pentagon just after the attack there.  Its pilot reportedly witnessed the explosion from the Pentagon crash. 
And television news reporters described a "white jet" plane that was "circling the White House" a few minutes after the Pentagon was hit.  (The White House is about three miles from the Pentagon.) Two government sources familiar with the incident later told CNN that the plane was a military aircraft, but its details were classified. An analysis by CNN suggested the aircraft was an E-4B, which is a militarized version of a Boeing 747 that is used as a flying command post.  One such aircraft is known to have taken off from an airfield outside Washington, DC, shortly before the Pentagon was hit. 
Considering the historical significance of the 9/11 attacks, which have had devastating consequences that affect us to this day, it is essential that important details surrounding those attacks be thoroughly investigated. We therefore need to know exactly what the two aircraft--Bobcat 14 and Bobcat 17--were, and why they were flying above the Pentagon around the time it was attacked on September 11.
 "Partial Transcript; Aircraft Accident; AAL77; Washington, DC; September 11, 2001." Federal Aviation Administration, September 20, 2001.
 9/11 Commission, The 9/11 Commission Report: Final Report of the National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States (Authorized Edition). New York: W. W. Norton & Company, 2004, p. 10.
 "Memorandum for the Record: Visit to Reagan National Airport Control Tower in Alexandria, VA and Andrews Air Force Base Control Tower." 9/11 Commission, July 28, 2003.
 "AA 77 Radar-Based Timeline and Maps." 9/11 Commission, n.d.; "9:37 a.m. September 11, 2001: Witnesses See Military Cargo Plane Near Flight 77; Pilot Later Implies he is Far Away." Complete 9/11 Timeline.
 "The Secret History of 9/11: The U.S. Government Reacts." CBC, September 10, 2006.
 "Planes Crash Into World Trade Center." ABC News, September 11, 2001; "The White House Has Been Evacuated." Breaking News, CNN, September 11, 2001.
 "Tropical Storm Humberto Heads for Texas; Democrats Blast Petraeus Timeline for Troop Withdrawal; Interview With General David Petraeus." Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees, CNN, September 12, 2007.
 Dan Verton, Black Ice: The Invisible Threat of Cyber-Terrorism. Emeryville, CA: McGraw-Hill/Osborne, 2003, pp. 143-144. According to former 9/11 Commission staff member Miles Kara, this E-4B aircraft took off from Andrews Air Force Base and was airborne at 9:27 a.m. See Miles Kara, "9/11: The Mystery Plane; Not so Mysterious." 9/11 Revisited, June 30, 2009.
Posted: Sep 2 2009, 02:00 PM
Member No.: 225
Joined: 1-August 08
well, my first thought is this: here comes more convoluded air traffic ambiguity meant to cause confusion - intentionally injected (at a very opportune time) in an attempt derail/minimize what we've uncovered. what i mean is that maybe "they" are trying create a pretext behind which they can claim that one of these 2 planes was seen flying over - and it was one of these planes that was witnessed by roosevelt roberts.
but thats just my initial impression. i dont know who shoestring is and i dont usually keep up with his/her blog, so i dont know for sure what his/her intentions are for bringing these 2 planes 2 light. but i do know that what he/she is proposing makes it convenient for some obfuscator to inject awhole new batch of 2nd plane disinfo.
i guess we'll see in time if thats what happens...
Posted: Sep 2 2009, 04:44 PM
Member No.: 1,046
Joined: 12-July 09
The first reference he cites, a Sept 20, 2001 FAA memo, looks reasonably authentic, but gives no indication exactly where these aircraft were in the sky, and don't even definitely indicate they were anywhere near the Pentagon itself. Shoestring's paper even states "Bob Lazar, the acting operations manager at Reagan Airport on September 11, said he "did not remember any aircraft with the call sign 'Bobcat' that hung out over the National airspace" that day. All he could say was that he did remember two aircraft "coming from the north, but he did not think that they entered National's airspace."
So while it's interesting to learn of these reports, and they need to be considered in the overall picture, they don't necessarily have any real bearing on what happened at and immediately around the Pentagon itself, nor on CIT's work, especially since they were at 21,000 feet and hence obviously not anything sighted by witnesses of a low-flying aircraft.
Posted: Sep 2 2009, 07:28 PM
Member No.: 586
Joined: 24-September 08
I think Shoestring is the UK and he generally just seems to dig and research without putting too much of a spin on things.
Posted: Sep 3 2009, 02:02 PM
Member No.: 1,023
Joined: 29-April 09
The C130 pilot O´Brien admitted to CIT that he did not witness the Pentagon ´attack´.
He arrived 3 minutes later saying that he had trouble keeping up.
Just keeping ya right mate.
Incidentally, was it one of these ´bobcats´ that ´let it slip´ about Flight 93 being ´shot down´?
If you want to get an idea of what was REALLY happening with certain aircraft that day have a look at Dominic DiMaggio´s YT account under Terrorcell2.
Now THAT is one aircraft we should be interested in.
I have seen Shoestring´s paper on the fake firemen and ´Johnny´ the fake military and his friends. Good piece.
But as regards the plane I believe any info ´leaked´ about aircraft that day should be taken with a pinch of salt.
Those in Washington airspace were used as distractions.
They were hardly there to protect jack shit.
The bobcats may have been another distraction in the ´was Flight 93 shot down or not´ operation.