Dollhouse- SPOILER THREAD

[Ertia]

Okay! Please post discussion regarding The Dollhouse containing spoilers (including reviews, etc,) here!

[GrimJack]

I will gladly discuss, but as of right now, I have major concerns.

*cough* Alias meets the Matrix *cough*

However, I never judge a show until I see the 'second episode'...pilot's are usually weak.

I do like the Fed though (always dug Helo on Battlestar).

[Ertia]

The reviews all say that the first few episodes are poor- that they don't have the chemistry. They made Joss reshoot this first ep, so it's not surprising that it's got issues. The actors are saying they really hit their stride in the fourth episode and feel that it just gets stronger from there.

I like the blond tech-geek guy and her keeper, as well. (Not as fond of the fed, but that's just a personal thing) but...

Where was the dialogue? Where was the wit? The tight characterization? I didn't CARE about any of these characters except for the little girl who was kidnapped! (Yeah, it says something that she and her dad had the best dialogue of the ep, I think.) The opening scene was just painful to watch- I think they should have cut it out, leapt straight into the episode and used hinting exposition later in the ep to explain where the Dolls come from.

The FBI boardroom scene? Made me sleepy. Why use the interspersion of the fight scene to emphasize what could have been done with straight up excellent dialogue?

The only scenes that seemed Joss-worthy was the initial mission- the "No strings attached" bit had me cracking up. The rest was... just not there. But pilots can be rocky- I'll stay with it a while and see where it goes.

[Jeth Fiction]

He pretty much said this will be the last tv show he does in Rolling Stone. He didn't seem too happy.

It sounds like the first few episodes involved constant intervention on Fox's side, and Joss's signature style probably won't emerge, like E said, until the fourth episode or so.

Even so, a poor start can kill a show with a Friday night timeslot, I'm not really optimistic.

Dushku is as purty as ever, though.

[GrimJack]

Okay...I've found I need to comment on a few things...

I know this is damn near blashphemy but I'm scared it may be the truth.

I'm not going to be so quick to blame this on Fox. The crew that rutted up Firefly is long gone...this is Joss's car to wreck.

I have it on good authority that the Wonder Woman script Joss was working on was pretty bad...so bad a project that had been 'green lit' to begin casting was not only postponed but shelved.

I started to worry, but then Dr. Horrible shows up and all is right with the world.

Now we have Dollhouse, and to be honest, guys, even if the show takes off plot/script wise, I see an awful lot of similarities to other fairly popular sci-fi stories.

Alias, The Matrix, Dark Angel (rogue 'special' out to get revenge), etc.

I didn't see the 'concept' I wanted to see. Usually Joss hits you with something so unique you can't help but take notice. Dollhouse just seems so unbelieveably stale.

Ertia was right on with her comment about the characters, and I too could care less about them. However, that can be corrected with better scripts in future episodes...a concept cannot.

Now here's where I get downright mean.

Dushku doesn't have the acting chops to pull off this type of character. If we are to assume that she will be 'downloading' different personalities each week, I would expect to see a different performance each week...we ain't going to get that. In fact, the only actress from his 'stable' that could've done this role justice is Summer, and there ain't no way in Hell she's leaving Terminator (which is a rad show by the by).

Joss painted himself into a real corner with this one. Stale concept and a weak lead (I'm actually really hoping I'm wrong about Dushku), and unlike Firefly he doesn't have a compelling ensemble to fall back on.

I'll obviously keep watching but...

[Ertia]

I'm afraid I have agree with GrimJack on Dushku. What I saw was "Faith" and not getting past that. Unfortunately, it's her show. It was Dushku that got the greenlight from Fox to create her own show, and she called Joss to help her with it. They wrote the concept over lunch, if the story is to be believed.

In my opinion, this could have worked IF.. and I mean IF... they hadn't done so much exposition in the beginning- Mystery is the hook- Where do the Dolls come from? How are they created? What's the real story? Are the operators of The Dollhouse evil? Good? Somewhere in the grey? The only real mysteries we come out of the pilot with are how did the doctor get those terrible scars (or rather terrible make-up) on her face and how does she come to be working for the Dollhouse?

Anyway, I'll hold with it, but I'm not breath-holding. :)

[Jeth Fiction]

I read about that too, Ertia. It sounded like she called Joss for help, they came up with the idea on the spot, then Fox ate it up. Although I wouldn't be surprised if Fox revealed they make all of their shows over lunch. Or perhaps they use the Family Guy manatee system.

I guess I should have mentioned that when we watched it, oath had to wake me up. Twice. Granted, there was beer involved, but that usually makes me more interested in a show, not less (fist-pumps aplenty). Guess I'll go see if I can download it so I can give it a bit more meaningful critique.

[Jeth Fiction]

I thought this second ep was pretty damned shiny. Lots of parallelism within the episode which, being an acolyte of Edgar Wright, I enjoyed quite a bit.

The ending sort of confused me. It made it sound as if the psycho bow-dude was hired. I would have preferred it to simply be a random psychopath who did that kinda thing often, rather than have him connected with the overall story arc; it would have given the episode a better standalone status. Maybe I'm wrong and it will pay off somewhere down the road.


Anybody else want to see more of that girl with the lasagna?

[Jeth Fiction]

Hmmm.

I think Patton Oswalt and Joss Whedon were meant for each other.

[Ertia]

Okay. Now it's here, it's done it.

The Dollhouse is good. In fact, it's great and getting better every episode. Eliza Dushku is finding her feet - the fight with Ballard in this ep was very well choreographed, but in spite of "similar moves" I never felt I was watching Faith- She was a whole new creature.

And the twists and turns in this ep were awesome! I'd already pegged Ellie? Nelly? as a Doll, but when whatserface gives the order to kill her, I really fell for it, totally and completely.

Remote access, though... didn't we already show that was too tricky? Or... is Topher the one playing from the inside? Or... No. They upped his security clearance. I mean...w ait... Or was iit...

aw crap. I'm gonna need a white board and five different colored markers...

[Ertia]

Wow.
Okay, now it's over.
I'm not satisfied with the ending, and hopefully Fox will see fit to bring us Season 2.

I should have guessed about the doctor. Spider got it. I missed it. I like that Paul saved the girl... both of them. :) YAY!

And... OMIGOD! Alan Tudyk was rutting brilliant!

I do find myself missing Marcus Deckard, though. A Lot. :)

[Jeth Fiction]

I'm gonna have to rewatch it, because after they gave Sierra her imprint I don't recall ever seeing it in action.

The stuff between the doctor and Victor was great. And, yes, Alan Tudyk is a very special person. To think only a few months ago I saw him on a DirectTV commercial...

I think on the 18th Fox announces whether or not they pick up both this and Sarah Connor for another season. Considering they had another season low for viewership, I don't think there's a future for our dolls.

[Ertia]

I think they've already decided no on Sarah Connor Chronicles. I heard a rumor it has to do with the franchise costs being raised with the movie coming out.

We don't see the dolls programmed to go after Alpha except for November/Melly/Madelaine at the end. My guess is that if we actually get a second season, we'll see them out on the hunt for him.

It felt to me like this wanted to be a two hour finale and had to be cut and cropped down to what we got. It left a lot of open questions just begging for a second season. or a feature film. Or a bunch of lame comic books. oh sorry, outloud voice there. I'll try to control that.

[Taokan]

With these last few episodes especially, I think, Dollhouse has gone from a guilty pleasure to watch to a show I honestly look forward to every week.

So here's hoping somebody at Fox is looking out for us. Boyd, for one, I won't let go of without a fight :)

[Ertia]

DOLLHOUSE IS BACK, TONIGHT!